mwillems
Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Oakville, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 154
 
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Got my LR3 back.. and it works again.
LR found a faulty height sensor (left rear) that had been affected by moisture. This is after replacing the entire wiring loom there... you wonder how often this is going to happen, since there are exposed wires and connector clearly visible by the rear wheels (That light thing on the right is the tyre):
http://www.mvw.net/lr3/connector.jpg
And of course "visible to me" also means "visible to snow, salt and rain"... we will see. For now I am enjoying this car greatly again.
Michael
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 17th Apr 2005 11:06 pm |
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simon
Member Since: 11 Jan 2005
Location: Shropshire
Posts: 18296
  
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Mike,
Good for you mate. Long may you be trouble free from now on !
-s
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| 18th Apr 2005 5:00 am |
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Ecosse
Member Since: 07 Jan 2005
Location: Grampian, Scotland
Posts: 889
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I can see some "home spun" solutions approaching  - perhaps we will see Disco 3's with plastic bags covering up exposed cabling?  , or even just the application of dollops of grease or Waxoyl over the offending connectors to keep the water out Mike - keep us advised on any developments after your "fix"
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| 18th Apr 2005 6:48 am |
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BN
Member Since: 18 Mar 2005
Location: Here
Posts: 6463
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I have never seen such appalling wiring on a 4x4, but then Ford are not expert 4x4 builders like Land Rover were. How many of you guys have actually been in snow, deep water or mud and have had problems after. My thoughts are that with such connections underneath, capilliary action takes place and water is sucked into the connector. It will stay there and then erode or maybe short out the wires. Boats have an anode to stop electolosis (any boat experts out there) so perhaps the unfortunates have water in there wires, hence a lot of the problems reported.
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| 18th Apr 2005 7:04 am |
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Pelyma
Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Patching, Sussex
Posts: 15496
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I've been in a lot of mud, but as yet no problems  DS3 TDV6 HSE - Silver with Alpaca (old one) Gone
DS3 TDV6 HSE- Silver with Alpaca (new one) Gone
D4 HSE Lux - Montalcino Red Gone
Porsche Cayenne V8 Diesel S
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| 18th Apr 2005 7:45 am |
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cmyers_uk
Member Since: 10 Apr 2005
Location: Near Bristol, UK
Posts: 433
 
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Anodes on a boat are there because of having different metals immersed in water at the same time. They start to act like a battery and current flows. The current will be removing metal from one of the metal pieces = "electrolysis". By putting on sacrificial anodes the metal is removed from them instead of your prop.
I dont think you will find this a requirement on your landrover unless you leave it parked in water.
There is a spray you can get that seals electrics against water. http://www.ccl-light.com/docs/par36.html
Ive seen the demo where they spray a 240v light bulb and immerse it in water and it keeps on working with no problems.
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| 18th Apr 2005 8:11 am |
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DiscoMad
Member Since: 11 Jan 2005
Location: Warwickshire, United Kingdom
Posts: 190
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I have also been amazed at the lack of apparent protection for cable connectors (take a look at the large multi-way connector behind the nearside rear wheel (its behind a plastic shield and is best seen with the spare removed (viewd from the rear). (I do hope they have learned form the early TD5 engine loom problem of oil wicking down the middle of the cables right into the ECU unit...not pretty.)
However, the military do this all the time , using purpose designed sealed connectors, and it is possible that the LR ones on this vehicle are similar with seals on cable entry and seals arround the connector body.
By the way, the electrolytic action you mention can occur easily when a voltage is present between two different metals. It also occurs when the metals are touching - LR know this of course and do not allow different body panels to touch eachother (using plastic washers etc) otherwise we would have panels fallling off the vehicle.
But when it comes to the cabling, with very high voltages in some parts of the vehicle (lighting, ignition etc) it is very possible that flaws in manufacture will be found....as corroded parts, accelerated by the damp undervehicle conditions. I think this is why Mike is having so many problems.
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| 18th Apr 2005 8:32 am |
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mwillems
Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Oakville, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 154
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Indeed: my issues so far have been due to wet and corroded parts (wiring loom, height sensor) at the rear under the vehicle. Having these wires open seems to me as clever as leading wires through a fuel tank (which you may all recall they do in the Boeing 747, which is why one of them exploded outside New York some years ago).
I bet that soon LR will come up with fixes: special protective covers, etc. I hope they do it retroactively on our Disco3/LR3 rather than on next year's model!
M
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| 18th Apr 2005 12:12 pm |
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BN
Member Since: 18 Mar 2005
Location: Here
Posts: 6463
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cmyers, with no disrespect I do immerse my vehicles in water for some time. We wade for possibly 10 to 15 miles at a time sometimes. We also launch boats and leave the car with the trailer in the water as the boat will float off and we can then use the trailer as a harbour. It is a tool of work as my LR 110's & 90's are. They do not have a problem, well untill BMW then Ford became involved and things went a bit wrong from then. The electrics under my D3 are to be blunt about it, pretty rubbish, which possibly explains a bit about the other electrics.
Why do Saab place all their wires INSIDE the car, is it because they were built in a cold and wet climate and have salt on the roads in winter, which corrodes wires and acts to make electric? I am not a chemist, but I believe salt is used in the production of power with water ?
I am at Eastnor in May and cannot wait to get my hands on a couple or so of their cars. Bet they won't let me do what we do with ours?
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| 18th Apr 2005 1:02 pm |
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Gareth
Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26774
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All this makes sense, as mine always goes wrong after jet washing the underside. I had a quick look at mine this evening, and I think that the height sensors are exactly the same as on an air sprung Disco 2 rear suspension? what do you think?
If they are, then they should be pretty good in service, as my Disco 2 never went wrong and I was not aware of regular faults with the D2 air suspension on the relevant forums. Mind you, it was no where near as complex as D3.
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| 20th Apr 2005 5:47 pm |
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cmyers_uk
Member Since: 10 Apr 2005
Location: Near Bristol, UK
Posts: 433
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DiscoMad,
All you say is true. The wiring needs protection. I like the spray in my link. I believe it is similar to the sprays used by the marines to waterproof the wolfs for driving onto a landing craft from the beach and they are full of water then.
My point was that you dont need anodes because you are unlikely to leave the car immersed in water with two different types of bare metal in the water. Thus not needing an anode. From memory the recommended wading depth isnt even above the wheels. As with defenders etc if you wade deep you need to make modifications like axle breathers the same presumably holds true for the D3 but now may include things like rewiring 
Pick mine up at 08:30 on 22nd April (tomorrow) so no doubt Ill soon complaining about the build quality / design along with the others on the forum!.
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| 21st Apr 2005 4:24 pm |
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Pelyma
Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Patching, Sussex
Posts: 15496
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Wading depth is 700mm - greater than a defender, but I'm not sure how far up the wheels that goes. Of course you can go through shallow water and still cause great problems. I found that out years ago in a SJ413! DS3 TDV6 HSE - Silver with Alpaca (old one) Gone
DS3 TDV6 HSE- Silver with Alpaca (new one) Gone
D4 HSE Lux - Montalcino Red Gone
Porsche Cayenne V8 Diesel S
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| 21st Apr 2005 4:56 pm |
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Gareth
Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26774
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CMyers - don't be so cynical, you will be impressed and I hope you appreciate its many many good points.
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| 21st Apr 2005 7:26 pm |
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Ecosse
Member Since: 07 Jan 2005
Location: Grampian, Scotland
Posts: 889
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BN wrote:I have never seen such appalling wiring on a 4x4, but then Ford are not expert 4x4 builders like Land Rover were.
First we had BMW own LR, presumably gain some 4x4 knowledge in the process , and now Ford - as BN says they are not in the same league as expert 4x4 builders - so what are the possibilities that we see a degree of knowledge transfer to Ford for future Ford products & then LR being sold on again (after all I heard on the news the other day that Ford's profits were down 40% & there are always rumours as to the profitability of some of the compamies they have bought). It might even go some way to explaining the attitude I have encountered from LR CS
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| 22nd Apr 2005 6:37 am |
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Gurvan
Member Since: 02 Jan 2005
Location: Germany... Not far from both the US and Hard German rock...
Posts: 1089
 
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Come on guys... Ford has been producing 4x4 in the US for probably as long as Land Rover... Ford US that is... Ford F150 anyone ? Pick-up trucks are fairly common in the states (Oups, in your former colonies... ) and Ford Expedition, Explorer and so on have been on the market for a while already...
I don't think that they really need some "know-how" in that field...
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| 22nd Apr 2005 9:27 am |
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