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NJF
Member Since: 05 Oct 2007
Location: Gone
Posts: 2466
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| MT/R and deep winter use (< -10 centigrade) |
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We're getting to the point where the first set of (summer) tyres on the car must be replaced.
In the summer we presently run Pirelli Scorpion Zero: http://www.pirelli.co.uk/web/catalog/car-s...AR-SUV-VAN
In the winter we run Pirelli Scorpion Ice&Snow. http://www.pirelli.co.uk/web/catalog/car-s...AR-SUV-VAN
Each set has its own wheels.
Here's the question: we'd like to put a set of MT/Rs on the car, mainly as the standard winter tyre, with changeovers in summer when we go offroad, courtesy of a friendly fitter. (We'll replace the current Zeros with MT/Rs, run the Ice&Snow as summer on-road shoes until they run out and then re-shoe with Zeros, thus keeping the MT/Rs for winter & offroad.) The problem is, will the MT/R be suitable as a winter tyre? How well does it work down to -10 or -15 centigrade? Will insurance companies accept it in the case of an accident, as they would a true winter tyre? Goodyear's site doesn't say much: http://eu.goodyear.com/home_en/tires/repos...e=benefits
What do the Croisiere Blanche cars run on?
We don't particularly want to buy another set of wheels, but that's not impossible. We've also seen that some D3 drivers run MT/R all year and are happy with performance and ride, although UK winters can be much milder than continental Europe's
Any advice welcome. Advice on price also welcome, if UK is cheaper than Lux, because I'll be in UK in about 10 days.
Thanks. 
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 11th Jun 2008 9:32 pm |
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Snowy
Member Since: 06 Jul 2007
Location: At the end of my tether
Posts: 3079
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I don't think the MTR is a winter tyre due to the low silica content. Do a search on silica, and I think there was a thread started by AndrewS about it...
HTH The surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us yet.
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| 11th Jun 2008 10:42 pm |
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simon
Member Since: 11 Jan 2005
Location: Shropshire
Posts: 18296
  
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I'm pretty sure Andrew leaves his MTR's on when he goes snow boarding n Europe.
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| 11th Jun 2008 10:44 pm |
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flinty99
Member Since: 17 Mar 2008
Location: Northumberland
Posts: 2558
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How can Andrew wear MTR's whilst snow boarding - that must be interesting to watch 
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| 11th Jun 2008 10:48 pm |
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DG
Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
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Unless your insurance company specifies which type of tyre your vehicle requires at different times of the year then you cannot be penalised for using any tyre that meets the vehicle manufacturers specifications  21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
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| 11th Jun 2008 10:49 pm |
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Snowy
Member Since: 06 Jul 2007
Location: At the end of my tether
Posts: 3079
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But don't some european countries have laws that you must have a winter tyre on in the er winter? The surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us yet.
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| 11th Jun 2008 10:51 pm |
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DG
Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
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Agreed ...add the country local law to the manufacturers spec  21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
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| 11th Jun 2008 10:57 pm |
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Snowy
Member Since: 06 Jul 2007
Location: At the end of my tether
Posts: 3079
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Off the blackberry and on the PC now so a bit easier to search, copy and paste.... This is the thread I was talking about.
http://www.disco3.co.uk/forum/topic16033.html
Some useful tips on how to improve the silica content of your tyres towards the end of the thread  The surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us yet.
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| 11th Jun 2008 11:51 pm |
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NJF
Member Since: 05 Oct 2007
Location: Gone
Posts: 2466
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Great, thanks. I will read in the airport tonight.
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| 12th Jun 2008 3:32 am |
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DingMark
Member Since: 14 Sep 2007
Location: Perth Oz or Erbil, Iraq
Posts: 388
 
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I just checked the Goodyear USA site:
They show MTRs as rated 8/10 for Snow and something called the "UltraGrip" gets a 9/10 (anybody heard of that model?). Appears that MTRs should be good enough unless things get too cold. I do have relatives in the USA (Alamosa, Colorado, which one nice night got to -74F a few decades back. This helped convince me to move to Oz) who run MTRs without a problem. They find steel wheels crack so they run Alu wheels. Doesn't help the flowability of diesel much either.
No longer an expert on this subject. When the landscape here is all white, we think "salt".  Jim Dowell - D4 HSE TDi, 12,000 hydraulic winch & hidden winch mount, MTRs, TyreDog, Traxide 2 x aux battery system, fixed air compressor, Dolium roof rack, MitchHitch.
RIP 2005 D3 HSE V8 5 seater gold (stolen and torched)
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| 12th Jun 2008 3:48 am |
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DingMark
Member Since: 14 Sep 2007
Location: Perth Oz or Erbil, Iraq
Posts: 388
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Let's hope that US MTRs are the same as EU MTRs, Aus MTRs, etc or we're all confused. I suspect that it may be a difference between ratings and tests done for "snow" vs "winter" (the latter is not "snow" but is often found in Euro in "winter"). "Winter" tyres with silica (I'm told this allows them to soften up as it gets colder, vs rubber doing the opposite) get more grip on ice than just rough treads. A little known effect (at least outside parts of Alaska, Siberia, and Colorado) is that "ice" changes its structural shape at lower temperatures. Really cold ice (say at -40C) provides plenty of traction and isn't very slippery (tried to play hockey on a frozen farm field at -50C and couldn't even get the skates to slide). MTRs certainly work fine on ultra-cold ice, but maybe aren't as good on just-below-freezing ice. I probably can't test this out here (granted it's the middle of winter here in Oz, but it's a sunny 23C outside  ) Jim Dowell - D4 HSE TDi, 12,000 hydraulic winch & hidden winch mount, MTRs, TyreDog, Traxide 2 x aux battery system, fixed air compressor, Dolium roof rack, MitchHitch.
RIP 2005 D3 HSE V8 5 seater gold (stolen and torched)
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| 13th Jun 2008 5:45 am |
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AJS4X4
Member Since: 30 Mar 2008
Location: Surrey
Posts: 3224
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My experiance with snow and ice is not the best by far but have used both MT and AT tyres in the snow and the AT tyres wins, BFGoodrich used to make a tyre called the "Trac Edge", granted only in a few sizes but this was the best tyre I have used in the snow.
You need lots of small sharp edges to give traction in the snow so an MT tyre is not the best, the AT tyre will work better here.
As one of the posters said in very, very cold temps it's amazing how grippy the snow can get, my experiance only goes down to -28c which for me was tooooooo cold.
If a tyre was developed in a cross between the AT and MT tyre, ie, the mud lugs on the outside edge and all-terrain in the middle as was the "Trac Edge", I think this would fill most peoples requirements, we live in hope.
And then we come to "ice", well I know most will say chains are a pain but they work with both ice and packed snow and give a great feeling of security up and down dale, I like chains as IMHO are like a second insurance, they will also work very well in muddy conditions but can be very mucky to take off.
As I have said before, each and every one has different idea's on whats the best, and these opinions are mine, so over to you boys and girls.
Best regards
Andy www.ajstyres.co.uk
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| 13th Jun 2008 8:19 am |
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