Member Since: 10 Jan 2010
Location: NW Highlands
Posts: 5103
I didn't see anything in the 'waste' that wouldn't feed into looking good in those^ charts.
The admin cost of only having NHS 'courier' service possibly was lower than having someone doing logistics with private courier firms.
However, I imagine the private courier could get my back brace to the hospital, from the same city, before 4:30pm. Had it done so it would have saved 4 or 5 days of my taking up a bed and resources in the hospital. Sometimes you need some admin to improve the clinical efficiency.
When looking at healthcare spending in the US I've never had an American work colleague that didn't have private medical cover when working in the UK. They just cannot believe what we put up with as regards the massive delays (both waiting lists and waiting rooms) and cancellations in the NHS system. They also seem to have a much lower threshold with regard to acceptable teeth and general 'cosmetic health'.
None of my US friends could believe that I had to wait over a year from diagnosis to have my gall bladder out on the NHS and put up with the pain for that time just rather than paying to have it done within, at most, a week.
My SiL is having her gall bladder out tomorrow (at least, she's supposed to, who knows) having waited over a year and a half since diagnosis.Black 05 TDV6 HSE Auto
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54 TDV6 SE Man (killed by me )
31st Oct 2019 12:56 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
28 million people are not covered by public or private insurance in the good ol' US of A though 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
31st Oct 2019 1:18 pm
Ceekay
Member Since: 17 May 2009
Location: Bury
Posts: 2089
I personally think its as antiquated as the political system and certainly not fit for purpose, its the Land Rover of medicine as in we all love the great NHS but it lets us down constantly because of all the flaws that could of been remedied during the next upgrade but just wasn't really!
A few yrs ago now I hadn't been to the doctors in 25 yrs and had a slight simple problem I wanted them to sort for me but at the same time thought i would mention a couple of other items that had caused me pain for years. By the time I started to explain the third I was told my 10 minutes was up and would need to make another appointment If they hadnt of messed around with blood pressure and height and weight because they hadn't seen me for so long they could of actually of listened to what was wrong. I left with a hopeful intention never to return. Unfortunately I had to return a couple of years later and this time the doc said I will be honest with you your problem will be one of three things but we dont do anything about any of them so no point wasting money finding out which one it was
I think a hybrid of both private and NHS could be a good idea but if run by the government they will mess it up as they simply have not got a clue and do not listen to the people that do.
You would not put up with this service from anyone that you had paid money directly too in the real world or at least you would refuse to pay the full amount.
Everyone you speak to who has had a NHS experience has usually something good to say about the frontline but has nearly always had something mistaken or messed up or delayed there has surely got to be a better way of running it before we throw yet more monies at it!
There you go they can shout at me as well now! D4 HSE Lux MY16 Club Waitomo
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31st Oct 2019 1:18 pm
Someone-Gone
Member Since: 21 Dec 2015
Location: Gone
Posts: 5117
In the department mentioned, NHS work Mon to Fri.
At the weekend NHS pay for consultants and nurses outwith the HA area to come in and reduce the waiting lists, so it’s not the same staff, but people on their days off from other areas across the UK wanting agency renumeration.
If staff from the area want to do OT at the weekend, then they just get NHS OT rates.
Evening work tends to be private for both Consultants and Nurses from the area, but it is lower than agency rates, but above the NHS rates.
Neither scenario is depriving the NHS of consultants or nurses at a particular time, but it is costing the tax payer.
31st Oct 2019 1:25 pm
adam
Member Since: 20 Sep 2005
Location: Home and Happy
Posts: 6917
DG wrote:
28 million people are not covered by public or private insurance in the good ol' US of A though
Also, Company Funded Health Care in the US is almost considered a pre-requisite of a reasonable contract of employment.Now Golf GTI PP, 7 speed DSG.
Ex D3 and D4
31st Oct 2019 1:37 pm
highlands
Member Since: 10 Jan 2010
Location: NW Highlands
Posts: 5103
DG wrote:
28 million people are not covered by public or private insurance in the good ol' US of A though
Good point, but my point remains that most of the c.300m who do have coverage wouldn't put up with the NHS.Black 05 TDV6 HSE Auto
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54 TDV6 SE Man (killed by me )
31st Oct 2019 1:44 pm
Someone-Gone
Member Since: 21 Dec 2015
Location: Gone
Posts: 5117
PS As a rule of thumb, agency Consultants get about £4k per weekend plus expenses. Nurses about £600-£800 per weekend plus expenses.
They normally kick about in teams of a Consultant and 4-6 nurses. Not sure what the agency split is tbh.
I think a hybrid of both private and NHS could be a good idea but if run by the government they will mess it up as they simply have not got a clue and do not listen to the people that do.
I've twice needed emergency care in the last 11 years. On each occasion the way it was handled was superb. As soon as the acute aspect was dealt with I quietly removed myself from the process and got the follow up work done privately. Got me back to fitness (and back to earning and therefore paying taxes) quicker and notionally frees up a space on an NHS waiting list for someone more in need of state funded care.
I'm currently paying out a few hundred a month for physio and rehab, and as a result of the pace I've set myself and the hard work of the physio and the personal trainer I'm no longer in need of further surgery and can look forward to getting back to some degree of normality over the coming months. If I were using the NHS I'd still be waiting on the first physio appointment and would be lucky if I got 2 or maybe three sessions before they handed my a badly photocopied list of exercises and discharged me. This latter point made based on experiences of family and friends locally who suffered similar injuries.
Getting myself out of the system sped things up and means I have a chance of full recovery. With spinal injuries, the longer the wait for rehab the greater the chance of permanent disability.
While I've been going through this I've spoken with others who have been or are still in the NHS system yet have the wherewithal to do as I have and self-fund. Yet they refuse to do so on principle. So they are part of the log jam and are reducing their chance of recovery for a principle? Dogma is a funny old thing....
tl;dr A self-funded hybrid gave me a better outcome.I know it's not considered "kind" to say no these days, but no. Just no, ok? And if it's not ok, still no.
31st Oct 2019 5:23 pm
highlands
Member Since: 10 Jan 2010
Location: NW Highlands
Posts: 5103
Maybe they want to run for political office in the future?
Only using the NHS might be akin to only sending your children to state schools...and then getting lots of private tutors on the side?Black 05 TDV6 HSE Auto
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54 TDV6 SE Man (killed by me )
31st Oct 2019 5:35 pm
trainmanone
Member Since: 19 Dec 2014
Location: stockport
Posts: 366
just a question IF we go down the American route and have medical insurance IE no NHS what happens when the insurance company try to wriggle out of paying for the procedure /treatment due to the small print
just saying that's all
31st Oct 2019 6:54 pm
highlands
Member Since: 10 Jan 2010
Location: NW Highlands
Posts: 5103
I don't see any likelihood of us ever going that far down that particular path.Black 05 TDV6 HSE Auto
Grey 05 TDV6 HSE Auto (Gone)
54 TDV6 SE Man (killed by me )
31st Oct 2019 7:40 pm
RootinTootin
Member Since: 23 May 2013
Location: Here and now
Posts: 469
trainmanone wrote:
just a question IF we go down the American route and have medical insurance IE no NHS what happens when the insurance company try to wriggle out of paying for the procedure /treatment due to the small print
just saying that's all
My brother and sister-in-law reside in the USA. They have friends who cannot afford to give up working as their job gives them medical insurance. These friends have had need to use that insurance for ailments and, now diagnosed as having the problem, they will never be accepted for medical insurance anywhere else ( unless at exorbitant cost). I know much the same can and does happen here with ‘existing ailments’.
One of said friends was driving home when her husband had a heart attack at the wheel. They pulled over in a rural area and called 911 but didn’t know where they were PRECISELY and so the call handler hung up on her.She ran to a gas station to get the owner to call 911 but third parties are wary of doing that as, should an ambulance not be required (or covered by insurance) they may be held liable for costs. In the end, she called from the gas station herself and gave directions provided by the sales clerk but all the while she was aware that her husband was possibly dying in their car, alone.
My Dad, in Scotland, had need to call a doctor on Xmas eve morning . It must have been 2009/10 as the snow was thick on the ground. The Doctor couldn’t get his car near the house as Dad lives up a hill, and so he walked about 3/4 mile in the snow to get to him. An ambulance was called and just managed to get in , collect Dad, and drive 12 miles to the hospital. They were superb.
My brother and sister-in-law related this tale (and the fact that Dad gets his flu jag at home and has an annual home visit for a general check up) and their American colleagues were amazed.
I have my issues with the NHS but reckon that, particularly if they cut down on its abuse (drunks, time wasters etc), it is a pretty good service.
31st Oct 2019 8:29 pm
Mogwyth
Member Since: 03 Oct 2014
Location: Pwllheli
Posts: 3976
I will declare I do work for the NHS but that has never affected my opinion of it. For the vast majority for the time is does the job for the vast majority of the people, but it could better and could do it a lot more more efficiently.
Similar to James my wife need a minor issue dealing, hers was gynae related, it took a total of 6 appointments between GP and hospital and various tests ect. My sister in law is the US equivalent of a GP, said she would have took my wife into a treatment room and done the procedure on the first and only visit.
And one of things that bugs me is buying power, the NHS realy deosn't exploit it no where near enough, Tescos wouldnt let individual branches negotiate there own deals.
I passionately believe in an NHS free at the point of delivery, but I dont see the harm of using private companies to achieve that if its cost effective.==================================
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31st Oct 2019 8:52 pm
Someone-Gone
Member Since: 21 Dec 2015
Location: Gone
Posts: 5117
Apparently I am told you have a point. They simply cut the tag away with a curved scissors and cauterise it as they go if there’s any bleeding, which is normally minimal. Takes a few minuets.
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) 
If they hadnt of messed around with blood pressure and height and weight because they hadn't seen me for so long they could of actually of listened to what was wrong. I left with a hopeful intention never to return. Unfortunately I had to return a couple of years later and this time the doc said I will be honest with you your problem will be one of three things but we dont do anything about any of them so no point wasting money finding out which one it was 
