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DG
Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50934
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I don't think a delay of 3 secs is normal at all.....3 seconds is a very long time once you have applied the accelerator. Prior to my re-map I had a lag of around 0.5 to 0.75 seconds or so ...I didn't find that unacceptable and adjusted my driving to suit....but 3 seconds would be a different story. Are you sure it's 3 seconds ??? 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
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 10th May 2007 11:57 pm |
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bkehoe
Member Since: 25 Feb 2006
Location: Wexford
Posts: 1481
  
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DG, it feels like 3 hours when theres something heading for your drivers door and you're still not moving quickly! 
Any time it's happened me I've been gradually creeping slowly forward and then suddenly stamped on the pedal. Normally I've never noticed it, and as I've said, it was over 6 months ago till this week since it happened me again, so it's not common.
In standard tune on any auto D3's I've driven I have always been able to recreate an approx 3 second lag though. Usually by driving at maybe around 35MPH, taking foot off the throttle, coasting for a bit, and then flooring it (triggering the kickdown). Not as much of a lag since the VEP though, and I dunno about 07 ones as I haven't driven one. Had no issues with a manual D3 I had for a day either. IE - 05 D3 TDV6 HSE - Zambezi Silver
SA - 07 VW Golf TDI - White - Sold!
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| 11th May 2007 12:07 am |
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C6REW
Member Since: 10 Mar 2007
Location: Devizes, Wiltshire
Posts: 576
 
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There seems to be a lot of talk about the turbo and similar causing this delay.
I am now saying for the third time that I believe it is the adaptive memory gearbox. I may of course be wrong as a relative newcomer to the D3 but certainly not to auto's or diesels.
Is anyone out there getting their car serviced in the near future or picking up a new car? If so can I suggest you make sure the memory is wiped/reset then see what happens for the first few hundred miles.
If I am right then flooring the accelerator from standstill will work fine to start with, then assuming you drive normally, it will start to develop the delay.
Regards
Chris
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| 11th May 2007 8:36 am |
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10forcash
Member Since: 09 Jun 2005
Location: Ubique
Posts: 16534
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bkehoe wrote:Maybe also related to the kickdown being triggered upon a sudden full press of the pedal? As in both those situations with the threat of impending doom I would be pretty sure I'd have pressed the pedal enough to trigger a kickdown in the autobox, whereas in normal situations I'd never press the pedal that much.
Brendan, an interesting point, next time I get my hands on a standard auto D3, i'll do some experimenting...
C6REW, I've not said it was wholly engine or turbo related but responded to some who thought it is.... there is definitely something there but given the sporadic (and even on here, a relatively small percentage of owners with the issue) the other thing is how do you define driving 'normally'? there are a lot of variables involved here...
I regularly drive auto D3's that have never had a chance to become 'adaptive' due to constant change in drivers & driving environments, both exhibit some lag, one more-so than the other, both have roughly the same mileage and the same mix of road / offroad use so it's as near a 1:1 comparison as you can get, but I wouldn't say the worst of the two was anywhere near 3 seconds 
If it's reproducible, get a passenger to time the actual delay (or video it)
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| 11th May 2007 9:56 am |
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Gareth
Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26702
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Try this in an auto;
Roll along at walking pace, dab the throttle slightly (just enough to make it roll a bit faster), release the throttle for 1 second, then floor it. This produces a significant delay on mine before it takes off suddenly. It may well be turbo & torque convertor winding up.
The 07 model GS auto that I borrowed the other week also had this delay.
This is most likely to occur when queuing to join a busy roundabout, your rolling up to the line, back off for a second, spot a gap, floor it and Arrrgggghhhhhhh!!!!!
I however, do not often get caught out, and can predict it and drive accordingly. It is a big heavy vehicle, and a certain laziness has to be expected IMO.
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| 11th May 2007 10:14 am |
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Simong
Member Since: 26 Feb 2006
Location: Spectacular Yorkshire
Posts: 94
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Agree that the roundabout/junction situation is where I notice the delay the most, but it also shows up when you are half way through a bend that you have had to slow for and then accelerate to drive on. Except with this I may only be applying half throttle. The delay in this situation tends to be much, much less.
I can create the 3 sec delay when driving normally if I floor the pedal as well. Count one thousand and one... etc then release the pedal which results in no change of speed or increase in engine revs.
As I've mentioned before, I would be interested in what the LR tolerences/spec actually are. Can anybody find this out?
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| 11th May 2007 2:03 pm |
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DG
Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50934
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I think you have something wrong in there TBH I'd get it checked out by the stealer with you conducting the test drive and him sitting as a passenger. 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
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| 11th May 2007 2:09 pm |
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Simong
Member Since: 26 Feb 2006
Location: Spectacular Yorkshire
Posts: 94
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DG- The stealer is being very co-operative, it's LR who have washed their hands of it with the classic brush off of- 'They all do that Sir' & 'It's within our specification' When asked what this specification was, they fell silent and either wouldn't or couldn't tell me.
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| 11th May 2007 2:25 pm |
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DG
Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50934
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Could you get any independent advice from say the AA \RAC as to what is an 'acceptable' or 'reasonable' delay? 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
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| 11th May 2007 2:27 pm |
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C6REW
Member Since: 10 Mar 2007
Location: Devizes, Wiltshire
Posts: 576
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Hi 10forcash,
Not for one moment saying you did!
Just with my admittedly very small amount of experience I feel this problem is related to the memory.
When I handed the D3 back that I loaned from TH White after 1500 miles in the week, I mentioned that it probably needed a service due to the problem with the throttle appearing to stick! My words!
I then test drove the D3 I bought and actually said, 'that is great' and had no problem with it when I took delivery and drove it for the first few hundred miles. I guess it was about 1,000 miles later when I started to realise there was a problem.
Has anyone any idea how easy it is to reset the memory? Perhaps it can be done from the screen, everything else seems to be!
Alternatively how easy is it for the dealer? Perhaps a quick reset when passing may be possible?
Regards
Chris
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| 11th May 2007 4:17 pm |
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bkehoe
Member Since: 25 Feb 2006
Location: Wexford
Posts: 1481
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I think just disconnecting the battery for a few minutes resets it, though I could be wrong. IE - 05 D3 TDV6 HSE - Zambezi Silver
SA - 07 VW Golf TDI - White - Sold!
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| 11th May 2007 4:30 pm |
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Peter_OZ
Member Since: 25 Jan 2007
Location: Brisbane - Sunny QLD
Posts: 19
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C6REW wrote:I understand that this delay has been seen by you guys and found to be a problem for some time, with, it seems little understanding from LR!
When I borrowed the D3 that made me change from my TD5 and drove it for 1500 miles, it went from pulling away no problem to having a delay by the time I handed it back and I mentioned it to the service department.
When I picked my D3 up - 06 - it also drove well with no delay, but after some 1000 miles or so it now has a delay.
As Leigh has mentioned, I had already decided that the cause of this was due to the adaptive gearbox and the way I drive. So it suprised me to see that others suffer the same problem.
It has ocurred to me that if it where possible to get the memory side of the adaptive gearbox turned off this may stop the fault re-ocurring.
Anyone any idea if this is possible?
Regards
Chris
mine is an 07 model and I get that exact same thing - most bloody dangerous! If I wanted to drive like a lunatic to get it to map right I would have bought a race car not a Rover!
I think LR and the dealers are missing one very important point here. We all bought a very refined bit of off road vehicle, now I know it sounds contradictory but we did not buy a hoon mobile then needs to be flogged.
I'd be very interested in learning how to reset the memory as well.
I can say that I have had new loan D3s with same donk nad xmn set up as ours and they did not have this hesitation problem. We had one for 3 weeks so racked up about 1500kms on it and it was still responsive at the end but have to say think the dreaded hesitation may have been creeping in. So there may be some truth to the xmn adaptive memory being the culprit.
I am surprised LR have not been forced to do a global recall on these things as they are an accident waiting to happen. What will it take? a family wiped out by 40 tons of semi trailer before they take the problem seriously?
cheers
Peter
www.petenplanes.com.au 2007/8 TDV6 SE Active diff, cooler box, spotties, Alpine DVD, Hi-ICE, Premium NAV yada yada
www.petenplanes.com.au
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| 24th Aug 2008 10:25 am |
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London Lad
Member Since: 27 May 2008
Location: Suffolk
Posts: 505
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I moved from living in towns to living in the country in April this year and I purchased my first Land rover , a new D3.
My 2 previous 'main' cars were both BMW X5 3lt TDs. Now compared to the X5s, the Land rover inst as well made, doesn't go as well, doesn't stop as well and is full of err..... characteristics (faults and bugs)
However, it goes great off road and I can get loads and loads of stuff in it, and that is why I brought it in the first place.
The one thing that will probably make me part with it and certainly stop me ever buying another one, is the lag problem. Compared to ANY other car I have driven (and I have driven a lot) the lag in certain circumstances is appalling and dangerous. I don't know if its turbo or gearbox. I experience it the most when lifting the throttle to slow for a hazard and then re-applying the throttle with out any interim braking.
Lets not kid ourselves here, pre-emptive driving, left foot braking and remapping are all well and good and have their uses but shouldn't be a requirement just to get a normal throttle response in normal driving conditions. .
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You should never argue with idiots because they will just drag you down to their level....then beat you with experience !
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| 24th Aug 2008 11:27 am |
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Peter_OZ
Member Since: 25 Jan 2007
Location: Brisbane - Sunny QLD
Posts: 19
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Unnecessary quote removed
exactly my point. We should be able to drop a $100kAU get in and drive normally. To have to totally adapt our driving styles because this car has bugs is not on, especially when handing over serious cash. Now I can't comment on what a X5 is like as our budget does not stretch to such cars but I can say from any other car / 4WD I have driven, none have had an issue like this.
I wonder if every LR oner who has this issue went to the media and we got some air time on it wether LR would sit back on it's corporate backside and do nothing. Obviously Ford whoever owns them now are pulling the strings.
As for the quality of fitting etc I was very dissapointed in that. My wife had a little 3 series and build quality and appointments were of a much higher standard. 2007/8 TDV6 SE Active diff, cooler box, spotties, Alpine DVD, Hi-ICE, Premium NAV yada yada
www.petenplanes.com.au
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| 24th Aug 2008 11:34 am |
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cdodkin
Member Since: 18 Aug 2008
Location: Ex Pat Brit in California
Posts: 700
  
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Have already experienced the rolling stop/start lag on my 08 US Spec V8 - so it's not a turbo issue.
Will be taking special note how this plays out, both with driving style, and other people's experiences.
First time it hapened, it freaked me out!  08 LR3 SE V8 - 02 D2 SE7 V8
Porsche 911 (03 996) - 2013 MINI Cooper S
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| 25th Aug 2008 1:45 am |
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