Andrew van den Heever
Member Since: 09 Jun 2007
Location: Cape Town
Posts: 340
  
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I had the bush settling/alignment/uneven tyre wear issue and replaced the Wranglers with AT2's. I have been very happy, but at 5000km there is a wear pattern on the outside of the front tyres that is not smooth or flat, but is angled on each tread lug. Is this normal?
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 19th Aug 2008 8:53 am |
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robharvey
Member Since: 14 May 2007
Location: Durban
Posts: 138
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Got them on mine, looks a bit like a chainsaw. Whether it's normal or not I can't say, but my tyre guy didn't seem too fazed when I queried it, he thought it was acceptable.
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| 19th Aug 2008 8:59 am |
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AndrewW
Member Since: 06 Aug 2007
Location: Saddleworth
Posts: 2302
 
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No AT2-on-D3 expert here, but if the lugs appear "sharper" when you rub the TOP of the tyre
backwards = braking induced wear
forwards = power induced wear
Spirited driving  , especially with any diff. lock activity will exacerbate this.
Also blocks flared inwards = toed-in and outwards = toed-out, suggesting a geometry check...
You probably knew all that  and a real expert will be along soon but I used to get that problem spending too long in 4WD in my Series IIs.
Andrew 2006 D3 finally swapped for a 2016 D4 Graphite in Graphite grey. No mods
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| 19th Aug 2008 9:11 am |
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Andrew van den Heever
Member Since: 09 Jun 2007
Location: Cape Town
Posts: 340
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Thanks for the replies Rob and Andrew. I am a now just very wary of trashing anotther set of tyres because of a geometry issue. My Wranglers only lasted 25thousand km.
The tread pattern is worn in the way you describe as sharp in one direction Andrew. Is it OK that this is only on the outside of the tyre?
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| 19th Aug 2008 9:44 am |
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AndrewW
Member Since: 06 Aug 2007
Location: Saddleworth
Posts: 2302
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Again - not an expert but one of my Subarus always did that. It was set up higher than normal on its suspension and the dealer said to expect that. Do you do a lot in off-road suspension mode?
Also some (small) comfort if the wear is symmetrical across the two sides of the car (but the rubber still costs the same  ) 2006 D3 finally swapped for a 2016 D4 Graphite in Graphite grey. No mods
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| 19th Aug 2008 12:39 pm |
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Andrew van den Heever
Member Since: 09 Jun 2007
Location: Cape Town
Posts: 340
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Hi Andrew.
I have done some, but not a lot in offroad height (and just a bit in extended mode!). You know the aligmnent issue always concerned me a bit with different ride heights. Is the alignment a compromise ie set for a particular height, or is it correct for all heights once aligned in "geometric mode"?
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| 19th Aug 2008 1:39 pm |
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AndrewW
Member Since: 06 Aug 2007
Location: Saddleworth
Posts: 2302
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 I don't know!
I thought we might have attracted a real expert in here by now! I'm sure it's possible to create suspension geometry that is "true" in normal and off-road, but there must be a point in each direction where the alignment "goes off". It would seem reasonable to make the good range to operate through normal and off-road and let things get a bit out of line in access mode (always slow, nearly always flat) and extended (VERY slow, very short distance, huge wheel movement differences). I think there has been a mod. to the suspension for MY08 - but that was possibly the rear. (Experts! Where are you??)
I think it boils down to an alignment check and then having to live with whatever wear you get, when the alignment checks out.
I have a half-baked idea that tyre pressures could help, and what research I have done on "correct" tyre pressures leads me to believe that manufacturers' recommended pressures may not always be the optimum. We could do with the sort of pressure plate reading that shoe shops do for kids' shoes and runner's feet; that would show if there was more load on the centre of a tyre (overinflated) or the edges (underinflated) AND a difference between inner and outer edge if the camber angle was "wrong". A combination of too much positive camber with underinflation would wear the outer blocks.
I'm beginning to think I need a race-track, several D3s and loads of tyres to have a play... 
I'm going to shut up now and let a real tyre person put us right  2006 D3 finally swapped for a 2016 D4 Graphite in Graphite grey. No mods
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| 19th Aug 2008 3:37 pm |
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robharvey
Member Since: 14 May 2007
Location: Durban
Posts: 138
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Andrew(s),
My understanding regarding the alignment in different heights is as follows. The alignment is set up for std height. Once in offroad height the alignment will be out, but which way I can't say (although it seems probable that it would be the outsides that would wear quicker). That said I can't believe that the amount of time anyone spends in offroad height will have a material effect on their tyre wear.
Where are the experts??
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| 20th Aug 2008 5:14 am |
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AP Moller
Member Since: 23 Feb 2007
Location: Cape Town
Posts: 246
 
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Where are the experts? Indeed.
Driving on sharp rocky surfaces on steep slopes, about 50 to 60% of the outside lugs on the rear tires were lost or severely damaged. The left rear tire suffered the most: why i do not know.
All done with heavy vehicle, high tire pressures on steep side slopes over a relatively short distance of 110 km. The damage to the front tires were less, about 30 to 40% of the lugs, with less completely ripped off. Over a total of 1400km with two rear tires replaced, the same damage was experienced on loose sharp rocks. The damage to the front tires seemed to be less overall.
I believe it is the weight, side and steep slopes with a bad design of the lugs that does not extend around onto the sidewalls. Due to the vehicle being lifted in offroad height and extended with the tires running on the outside edges, this being more prominent at the rear, it is probably why the rear (as Rob says) with more weight that the tyres gets more damage.
I am concerned about the flimsy sidewalls. Under load the walls bulge out, exposing the tires to damage. I kept it at pressure at the rear of up to 3.1 to 3.3 bar (3.5 being max) and with heat bringing it up to 3.4 on occasion.
AT2's is not yet the answer for as a proper offroad tire. The problem is compounded by the use of 18inch rims.
Drive the vehicle, FULLY laden on a sideslope and see how the tire gets pinched, add rocks (sharp) and you have a cocktail for disaster ...
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| 20th Aug 2008 9:38 am |
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Andrew van den Heever
Member Since: 09 Jun 2007
Location: Cape Town
Posts: 340
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Has any one had alignment done without the vehicle having to be set into geometric mode? This seems like a real unnecessary hassle. I am keen to get my alignment rechecked but don't want to fork out another R1000 for the geometric setting.
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| 20th Aug 2008 9:54 am |
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Deondef
Member Since: 08 May 2007
Location: Randburg
Posts: 790
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Had my D3's alignment checked and set about 3 times now without doing the geometric thing. Seems like TWT has done enough D3's by now to do it without the setting, They basicaly lift it to extended mode and back to access a couple of times and then it settles.  Erstwhile - D3 S '07. Dual battery system. Upgraded tow hitch. Mantec skid plate. Frontrunner rr. Tmax double headed built in compressor
Defender TD5 110 CSW '00. "With everything"
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| 20th Aug 2008 10:19 am |
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robharvey
Member Since: 14 May 2007
Location: Durban
Posts: 138
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Andrew,
Someone in CT is murdering you if they are making you fork out a grand. Had mine done two weeks ago and it was R400 (ISTR LR got R100 and TWT R300).
AP,
I have dumped my back left tyre - it was showing much more wear than the others that went on at the same time. I think that for the first time in 35k my Grabbers are perfectly balanced. TWT did the job - I notice that they placed/stuck the wheel weights on the inside of the rim. What are the pro's and con's of doing this?
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| 20th Aug 2008 1:34 pm |
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Discoeast
Member Since: 19 Feb 2008
Location: Boksburg
Posts: 800
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My Bridgestone Duelers are also wearing on the out side edges only, but
if you feel the inner side there is a sharp edge on the corner of the tread,
no saw tooth. I'm running 255/65/17 at 2.5 bar and run a bit more weight
above STD daily, IMHO the sharp edges on the tread are tarmac related,
not off road.
Rob, the stick on weights get wiped off in mud and river bed driving,
in other words anything to do with driving in water. The LR weights
work great, if you can get them. But the guys who must do the job
don't have them
When TWT fitted my AT's I instructed them to use the clip on old
style weights, and there still there  D3 bullbar-spots-roof rack with spots-ladder-long range tank-swing out spare wheel carrier- upgraded tow bar-dash console-internal water tank-duel awnings-drawer system & T T.
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| 20th Aug 2008 4:26 pm |
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Andrew van den Heever
Member Since: 09 Jun 2007
Location: Cape Town
Posts: 340
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Thanks Rob.
I will try TWT, and hope that they get it right. I would hate to shred another set of tyres because of alignment/bush settling.
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| 21st Aug 2008 7:13 am |
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