Member Since: 07 Nov 2007
Location: Blue Mountains
Posts: 103
Rolled the D2, so now a D3 or Prado ?
Guys,
It's a sad day. A week ago, my wife rolled our Disco.
She was heading to work in peak hour, just past Penrith on the M4 in the wet, when someone cut in on her. She swerved to avoid the accident at 100km/hr and slid off the road into the grass median. Half-way across, it started to roll, launching over the barrier and rolling across 3 lanes of westbound traffic, to land wheels down in the breakdown lane on the far side. She just clipped one car right near the end.
She walked away with a small bruise on her elbow.
A miracle! Someone upstairs is definitely looking out for her.
After 8 years and 240,000km of memories, it's sad to see the old girl written-off.
So, now to decisions of what to replace her with. We are both dedicated manual drivers, it's part of the enjoyment of driving. We also want the option of 3 child seats across the middle row if we decide to have a 3rd child. Safety has also moved up our list. Leaves our options pretty limited:
- D3 is wide enough, and apparently if you twist the right persons arm you can factory order a manual SE, but costs a bomb.
- 200 Series has no manual option. What the ? Besides, it's ugly and even more expensive.
- Prado D4D is great value, but not sure if it's wide enough. It's $20k cheaper than D3 for similar spec.
- 100 Series Second Hand. Not sure about handling & safety.
Hmmm...
Hard decision.
So I want to hear from anyone with a D3 about what it's like. Especially if you have a manual.
1. Who has a manual, what is it like ? Anyone know a dealer with one I can test-drive ?
2. I hear there are problems with the electronic brake ?
3. Wheels/Tyres: I plan to get a second set of rims for bush tyres and keep sticky road tyres for day to day. So:
A: What are the OEM 18" tyres like ?
B: What is a goo high performance/grip 18" tyre for road only ?
C: What is a good offroad 18" or 17" tyre ? Thinking of the BB6 rims for second set ?
The accident was after a bush weekend, and I am sure the fact I left the BFG AT's on contributed to the slide in the wet. There is a huge difference in road handling and grip between OEM Michelin and BFG AT. But Michelin don't last in the bush.
G'day Scott,
Welcome aboard. Sorry to hear about the D2. Thankfully your SWMBO got away without too much physical trauma.
DO NOT BUY THE PRADO. (but then I'm biased).
The auto box on a D3 is a ZF and can be driven as a manual. I drive prob. 50% Man. 45% normal auto & 5% sport.
EPB: I have not had a problem (touching wood whilst saying that) others have.
Test drive and see the difference between the best 4wd in the world and the rest.
BTW try a Toyoda dealer when you have problems and see if you can get him/her to take his fingers out of his/her ears and stop them saying "la la la la la can't hear you".Did you think I would leave you crying,
When there's room in my D3 for 7,
Climb in here Joe we'll soon be flying,
I can go just as fast with 7.
2005 TDV6 S with Terrain Response (& all that entails), Tasmods (gorn). 2008 TDV6 HSE (gone). A Dark Side umbrella (here) & car (here).
Member Since: 11 Jul 2007
Location: Tuam
Posts: 400
I can answer No 1 as I have one
Like your self I think a manual is part of the fun of driving and gives you something to do I have no problem with the box it works fine but to be honest I think with hindsight now I Should have goon for the auto as its a very good box and its a bit easier to use off road I think you need to give it a go first before writing it off the D3 is not an upgraded D2 its a hole new car
I'm glad your missus walked away with only a bruise. The D2 looks pretty stuffed. I'm sure if she was in anything other than a 4WD she would not have walked away with only a bruise.
The Toyotas are old school technology in the suspension department (i.e. live rear axle). I know that the D3 is far superior in handling on the bitumen or fast dirt with corrugations over anything with live axles. I'm confident to say that the D3 with air suspension will have far better articulation than any stock LC100 or Prado. I can't comment on the LC200.
Fitting 3 baby seats across the middle row will probably fit at a squeeze but when you move to booster seats, using the lap sash seat belts you will find difficulty in trying to insert the buckles because the boosters are quite wide (well mine is anyway) and they will cover the seat buckles. I'm sure it is possbile to clip in with a bit of effort.
Looking at the LR website I think the manual is only on an "S". I'd be surprise that you could get a "custom" D3 beyond the options list but you can only ask. Try out an auto, you will be surprised how well the auto with TDV6 engine brakes. I've never found my D3 running away down a really steep hill in low first, barely use the brakes unless I want to stop. The command shift does work well and allows you to select gears in both hi and low range.
Electronic Park Brake (EPB) has had a few issues (but limited) and to be honest if there was a fully mechanical brake then that would have been better in my opinion. There is a poll in this website and I was actually surprised that not many people have had problems. I've had problems only once and it was requiring adjustment and all is fine again. Others have had dust/mud inside the drums that have caused problems.
As for wheels and tyres. Yes, get the 17" BB6 Performance Wheels or GMAX M168 which allows you to fit Coopers STT's in a similar diameter to the OEM 18" tyres. Others on this forum have fitted BFG's in 17" but a bigger diameter. If you are sticking to the spare under the back then you need to keep close to the 30" overall diameter tyre to allow it to fit or you need to fit a rear wheel carrrier. There seems to be replacement 18" road tyres beside the expensive Goodyear Wranglers that don't last as long as you would like. For example Cooper HT+ and Yokohama AT-S. The Goodyears seem to grip in the dry and wet okay but I'll be trying an alternative next time round.
Hope that is of some help
Happy test driving.
Chris2011 Discovery 4 (MY12) SDV6 HSE with General Grabber AT's, Traxide Aux Battery system, custom rear drawers and Autosafe half height cargo barrier
Gone - 2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 HSE
ARB Bull Bar, Warn 9.5XP Winch, IPF D/Lights, Cooper STT's, LR Raised Air Intake, Traxide aux battery system, custom drawers and half height Autosafe cargo barrier, Mitchell Bros 4x4 tow hitch
7th Nov 2007 11:13 pm
pbhawkin
Member Since: 14 Dec 2006
Location: Mudgee
Posts: 377
Scott,
sorry about the accident and glad missus is ok!
Interested to see that ALL 4 tyres were flat!?
I also had a D2 like yours (1999 TD5 manual) and now have a TDV6 SE auto.
It IS the Ducks guts !!
My understanding was the factory was DROPPING the manual on ALL models as an option!
As said before the auto can be driven like a manual and in experimenting with it I am unable to achieve better mileage (l/100k) doing this! The auto is ADAPTIVE and learns your driving style (until they reset it during a service) over a period of time. Sometimes there IS a noticeable lag when trying to fast accelerate after having slowed down with foot off accelerator (Ie roundabouts) BUT this is overcome by either anticipating the lag or moving into 'sport' mode.
I have a 5, 2 and 1 year old and 2 are in baby seats and 1 in a booster and have NO issues with fitting across the second row of seats. Although the 5 yo likes riding by himself in the rear row when able!
I have NOT had a problem with daily use of the EPB.regards
Peter
__________________________________________
Oct 2013 SDV6 3.0 HSE.
2007 TDV6 SE E-diff, adaptive lights sold 1/2014
Scott - sounds like an horrific accident, but someone definitely looking out for you and your misses!
Go the D3 - it really is in a class of its own - again, biased, yes - but my brother has had Pajero's for years, and he gets by, but they are not a patch on Disco's, and the D3 is outstanding!
Any problems are, in the main, minor, and what vehicle doesn't have problems - especially if used for what they're built for...
I bought the auto - the first auto I've owned after 26 years of driving - it's fantastic!
All the best with your decision making!
cheers,
SimonD3 - Buckingham Blue, SE, TDV6, 06 model; chipped; underbody armour; Mickey Thompson ATZ 275/65-18 AND MAXXIS Bighorn muddies; rear wheel carrier from 4x4intelligence.com; iPOD aux connection! GME 3200 UHF - aerial mounted on wheel carrier ; LR roof rails/cross bars; Autosafe cargo barrier, Safari Snorkel; Traxide - aux battery; ARB bull bar with Tigerz11 winch; Lightforce 240 XGT driving lights (mitchell bros tow hitch to come)
8th Nov 2007 12:37 am
SKP
Member Since: 07 Feb 2007
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 219
Scott,
Pleased to hear your wife is OK, could have been horrific ! Those BFG's are not good in the wet.
Test drive a D3. Take it out on a (empty) corrugated, ball bearing gravel, wide road at speed, swerve, then hit the brakes. You will be gobsmacked
The D3 is the most amazing vehicle that I have ever driven
Forget Landcruisers. I drove a LC 100 GXl in the Kimberley on a road that I could comfortably sit on 80 - 100kph in my D3. In the LC I was really s g myself doing 40kph
Forget the manual D3, the auto is the way to go.
8th Nov 2007 2:56 am
caverD3
Member Since: 02 Jul 2006
Location: Oberon, NSW
Posts: 6922
Welcome to the forum Scott,
It's scrary rolling a D2, although mine was at 0kpm, at speed it must be terrifying.
Glad you better half came out ok.
I found myself in a similar situation when I rolled mine. The D3 was expensive compared to the D2.
I looked at all options. Test drove all that I could ( Toyota dealers would not find ma diesel 100 series to test drive ) Besides the D3 Se was the same plice as a GXL 100 series anyway.
Tested the others on dirt and on tar. LR dealer lent me a D3 for a couple of days and when I sold the other car sooner than I thought they lent me one for ten days.
I discovered the D3 was the best value for money and since then the LR dealer has been great with small warranty issues.
Check out all the options and make your choice.
Let us know what model of D3 you buy. “There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely gamesâ€
Ernest Hemmingway
D4 3.0 Active Diff, Adaptive Lights, High Beam Assist, Surround Cameras, Privacy Glass.
D3 2.7:Adaptive Headlights,Electronic Rear Diff,ARB Bar,Blaupunkt Speakers,JVC Powered Subwoofer,Removable Snorkel,Mitch Hitch,Pioneer After Market Head Unit,Steering Wheel Control Adaptor,Remote Adjustable Supension Rod System, Taxside Dual Battery System.
8th Nov 2007 7:51 am
PierreJ
Member Since: 22 Aug 2007
Location: Perth, W.A.
Posts: 448
Hi Scott,
Some of the guys back in South Africa called me a fanatic, but one thing they have never been able to to prove me wrong, and that is that once a Landy driver, always a Landy driver. You can buy just about any more reliable vehicle for much less money, but then it would not be a Landy. So what is the point.
I guess after 15 Landies, I find it very hard to even contimplate not having one. Perhaps an obsession, but then again, I do not do drugs, or hurt little animals.
What does it mean to drive a Landy? It means that you might get stuck in the middle of nowhere, with a broken side-shaft, or a packed up coil. Maybe not the D3, but had some nice memories of a Series vehicle.
It also means that you that you notice every single LR on the road. Do you even notice LC or Prado's? Perhaps they are not sold here in the west!
If you had your D2 for 240K km's it means that you will also keep your next vehicle for that period of time, but only if it is a LR. Trust me you will long back to owning a Landy. If you do get a Prado, and you do not miss driving a Landy, PM me, as I would like to be proven wrong. I think SWMBO would appreciate it, as I believe in her mind there are other vehicle on the road. Why is the fear of long words called hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia?
8th Nov 2007 10:38 am
Martin Krutli
Member Since: 17 Apr 2007
Location: Adelaide
Posts: 229
Prado or D3
Hear your concern about manual trans - have always prefered manuals myself, but the new, modern auto's with manual shift options are really the best aoption - particularly of road.
I've just been thru the same process as you. My NM Pajero w full of-road kit (Tough Dog suspension et al) was due for replacement and I'd narrowed the decion down to the D4D Prado GXL and Disco TDv6 SE. Had both vehicles out for a day on loan and took them both thru exactly the same roads. There is honestly no comparison. The Prado is a good honest vehicle and goes pretty well, albeit with plenty of body roll - my wife got car sick in it. I was concerned that the Disco may not be reliable enough for outback work and - as yet, I don't know the answer to that. We bought the Disco because there really was no comparison for comfort, space utilisation, drivability and general flexibility. The Prado would have (for me) required significant modification to make a good tourer - new suspension, front end rebuild, different seats and a few other bits and pieces. The Disco needs very little - a new tow hitch (a must if your going to tow off road) probably some more tankage and like all modern 4WDs, better tyres. I've fitted BFG AT's in 265x65x18 and they work nicely. Hardly any extra noise on the road (unlike in the Pajero on which I also had them fitted) and give a usefull 20mm extra clearance. On the Pajero they had done 85K km when I sold it and they were probably good for another 10Ks.
Yes, I'll have to fit a rear wheel carrier, but I'd do that anyway as under the vehicle is no place for a spare wheel if you have to get it out off road.
I've had the Disco noe for only 2 wks, so I can't comment about reliability - but it is an absolutely brialiant car to drive and, to date, everything is perfect (as you'd expect it to be).
Good luck with the decision making. Pity it's been forced on you by such an unfortunate incident.
Cheers,
MartinMY08 TDV6 SE. White/Alpaca. BFG265/65/18 At's
Autologic, Trackside Dual Battery syst., Remote GME UHF, 4X4 Intelligence rear wheel carrier, Boab removable rear drawer system w National Luna fridge, Mitchell Bros hitch.
Rasta Plate. 110L LRA long-range fuel tank.
Scott - good to hear your wife walked away safely!!
If you enjoyed your D2, you'll LOVE the D3! 40k, and over 12mths ownership, I've had no major issues.
Almost bought the Prado - Grateful that I didn't!!
Never spent this amount of money on a car - Grateful that I did!!!
Take them both for a drive.........I've been in a few Prado's and the ride in the D3 feels more refined. Just drive over a few speed humps and you'll feel the difference.
In answer to a couple of your questions - had no problems with the park brake; the OEM tyres are great on the road, but may last to only 35,000km or so. Got the Yokohama Geolander AT's (18") on now - lovely. I use the auto:manual probably 60:40 on the road, but, 100% manual off road of course. I don't lose any sleep over not having a clutch pedal.
Good luck.'11 TDV6 - Stornoway Grey.... still lovin' it!!
REDUCE GREENHOUSE GASSES.......Eat more BEEF!!
Addendum: Red wine goes REALLY well with BEEF
I've had my park brake adjusted once in 103,000km.
Buy a D3. Anything else is a pretender.Have a nice day!
2010 Cayenne Diesel with PASM & Off Road Pkg
2005 HSE D3 (Sold)
8th Nov 2007 12:49 pm
smwilk
Member Since: 15 Oct 2006
Location: Gold Coast
Posts: 44
Hi Scott,
Glad to hear your wife walked away from the rollover. They tell me the D3 is safer again, apparently 3x the safest volvo!
I had a TD5 manual for 5 years and it was a great truck. Iv'e had the D3 auto for 12 months as of yesterday and it's brilliant. I was also dubious about getting an auto but the ZF6 is just terrific. My brother has a TD Prado (not D4D) and it's a nice enough truck, but not in the same league. Spend the extra and you'll be happy!TDV6 D3 HSE
Previously D2 TD5
9th Nov 2007 10:50 pm
stevo68
Member Since: 23 Feb 2006
Location: Gold Coast
Posts: 49
Hey Mate, ditto all the above re: SWMBO etc. Obviously here you are going to get a pro D3 vote, go to another 4by site, most likely mixed. So therefore comes down to biased opinions of happy owners 8) . For me, the D3 has been hands down best vehicle I have owned, great on road, excellent offroad. It has more and more options available ie rear wheel carriers, long range tanks, protection etc. We have 4 children between us and one on the way, the size and 7 seats fit all comfortably. I have also had 7 (including myself) men in the car, again all comfortably. The interior is what I call practical luxury as opposed to say a ML or X5, or dare I say it an RR/S. I've had a couple of very minor niggles in almost 90,000kms and they were early on in the piece and now wears its array of scratches and marks with pride. Aside from all that a Prado just doesnt have this presence:
Click image to enlarge
Regards
Stevo
Admin note: this post has had its images recovered from a money grabbing photo hosting site and reinstated 2005 D3 HSE V8, General Tire AT2 255/55/R18, Kaymar Rear Bar and Wheel Carrier
Off Road: http://server1.pictiger.com/albums/563/ormeau-hills/
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!!
; LR roof rails/cross bars; Autosafe cargo barrier, Safari Snorkel; Traxide - aux battery; ARB bull bar with Tigerz11 winch; Lightforce 240 XGT driving lights (mitchell bros tow hitch to come) 
g myself doing 40kph 
at speed it must be terrifying. 
) Besides the D3 Se was the same plice as a GXL 100 series anyway.
