Member Since: 08 Mar 2024
Location: Manchester
Posts: 23
Slowly revs up and rocks on idle
7th Apr 2024 8:37 pm
Discobob!!!
Member Since: 08 Mar 2024
Location: Manchester
Posts: 23
Fireburst wrote:
Hi, My money is on the crankshaft position sensor.
I have just had a situation where the car would stall and after several attempts would restart and run for a month without issue. The IID kept showing no faults!
I replaced the starter motor and it started immediately, I thought I had fixed it but one week later it stalled again on my drive and no way would it restart. Because I got a battery warning on the dash I thought I would replace the alternator with a genuine Denso and it started straight away, ran fine for about a week and then the engine cut out while I was driving. I got the car home and tried the IID again this time I kept the engine turning over for at least 10 - 15 seconds and got a crankshaft sensor fault message.
Replaced the crank sensor and the car has been running perfectly for for the past month.
Good luck!
So im leaning towards this as the issue now, ive rechecked all the timing and the 3 pins line up and after 2 rotations line back up so ive ruled incorrect timing out.
When i hooked it up to the diagnostic, it did say both camshaft and crankshaft sensor faults but the lad with me said they’re linked so could have been the camshaft that was replaced but maybe it was both.
So the car starts fine which it didn’t do before all the parts I replaced and now its just a constant misfire on the drivers side. I thought it was a knock but when i removed the intake it pops so im pretty confident its a misfire
14th Apr 2024 10:41 am
PROFSR G
Member Since: 06 Mar 2017
Location: Lost
Posts: 5040
What codes are being logged?yµ (idµ - eAµ) ψ=mψ
14th Apr 2024 1:19 pm
Discobob!!!
Member Since: 08 Mar 2024
Location: Manchester
Posts: 23
Any advice on how to get the crankshaft sensor back in? I’ve tried all sorts of ways and even roped the wife in but i cant for the life of me get it back into the hole with the bolt lined up. A mate said he takes the gearbox out but that seems a but excessive for a sensor and doesn’t mention in the workshop manual
5th May 2024 2:17 pm
PROFSR G
Member Since: 06 Mar 2017
Location: Lost
Posts: 5040
There's essentially two way's for the D4. (1) remove the upper suspension arm and the heat shields. Then you should have a clear albeit a narrow line of sight of the sensor housing from the top of the chassis rail. Using a series long 1/4" extensions you can then access the bolt. Other bits & bobs such as the turbo drain etc need to be moved also.
(2) The "old way". For this you will need the aid of a snake neck inspection camera (cheap on the net) This has to be judiciously placed so that it's held hands free, and that you can monitor what you are doing on your phone. And that will also need to be strategically placed!
Think of it as endoscopic surgery and if you didn't already, you'll have a very definite appreciation for the surgeons who do this day in day out!
If the auto transmission lines are hindering your access you will need to move them. Nothing worth worrying about will spill from the transmission, but ideally new seals should be fitted. Below is a pic of the sensor on a D3 just to give you an idea of what you are dealing with. The camera lens became fogged up hence the poor quality.
For the most part you're working completely blind (hence the camera). It's not an easy job but definitely not a "transmission out" one either! Patience and perseverance are key attributes for this little piggy.
yµ (idµ - eAµ) ψ=mψ
5th May 2024 3:05 pm
Discobob!!!
Member Since: 08 Mar 2024
Location: Manchester
Posts: 23
Thanks mate, and looking at that picture and the screw to sensor orientation, the screw is on top or under the sensor if you know what I mean.
5th May 2024 3:46 pm
PROFSR G
Member Since: 06 Mar 2017
Location: Lost
Posts: 5040
If memory serves me correctly on a D4 it's at the bottom, under the fly lead. yµ (idµ - eAµ) ψ=mψ
5th May 2024 5:09 pm
Discobob!!!
Member Since: 08 Mar 2024
Location: Manchester
Posts: 23
Yeah i think you’re right mate cheers. Im going to order a little camera and see what it looks like and then decide the plan of action.
Im missing the beast now so can’t wait to get it up and running again, I don’t care what people say about them i love it and hopefully i can get at least 12 months before the next issue 😂
5th May 2024 6:02 pm
PROFSR G
Member Since: 06 Mar 2017
Location: Lost
Posts: 5040
Just a tip when using an endoscopic camera.
The external lens glass cover on these cameras tend to be extremely brittle. If it touches any metal part while you are trying to get it in place there's a very high probability it will crack, thus rendering any image useless. You can circumvent this by placing a piece of firm hose over the camera end so that it sits 3-5mm proud of the end of the lens. It won't impair the image but it will protect the incredibly thin glass.
A few wraps of strong tape would do the same, but it may collapse if you contact a hard surface thus blocking the image! Then you have to withdraw and start all over again. yµ (idµ - eAµ) ψ=mψ
5th May 2024 6:26 pm
Discobob!!!
Member Since: 08 Mar 2024
Location: Manchester
Posts: 23
Ok so ive got a camera off my mate, whats the best approach as in from under the car, through the wheel arch or what?
I doubt my hand will get down through the wheel arch and past the bits to the hole
6th May 2024 12:09 pm
PROFSR G
Member Since: 06 Mar 2017
Location: Lost
Posts: 5040
I have the car on a lift for this job and have a long snake which I thread up from below. So it's a case of getting the lens into place whatever way you can and fixing it there, or use an assistant.
It's going to be a bit of a faff and jiggery pokery to get a view that doesn't get in your way when accessing the bolt.
100mm to 125mm long torx will make this a lot easier! yµ (idµ - eAµ) ψ=mψ
6th May 2024 12:18 pm
Discobob!!!
Member Since: 08 Mar 2024
Location: Manchester
Posts: 23
Ok and just for clarity the old one is out and it looks like one of the wires was exposed so probably chucking off poor readings or something.. I got the bolt off by using a 300 mm extension and looking through the hole in the top suspension arm.
Removing it was a bit of a wiggle but got there, so now putting the new one back in, i can just about get my finger tips up past the front prop shaft to the hole but its a couple of fingers so manoeuvring will be limited. Is there a better access point to put the new one back in place?
6th May 2024 12:28 pm
PROFSR G
Member Since: 06 Mar 2017
Location: Lost
Posts: 5040
Have a read of this from a D3 sensor replacement.
PROFSR G wrote:
You won't see any damage to the sensor, (unless the garage has botched it) and will be doing well if you see it at all!
The reason you need to drop the diff is just so you can get some access. Remove the N/S road wheel and the engine undertray. Mark the position of the drive shaft coupling to the flange, once you have undone the drive shaft bolts use a block of wood and hammer to shock it loose from the coupling. (be very careful here not to damage the joint!!) Place a jack under the diff to support it, then undo the support bracket, and finally the side mount bolts (mark them first) Lower the diff until it rests on the chassis.
If the drive shaft is causing you access woes you might have to remove it completely. If so mark the joint to the gearbox flange and undo the bolts. It can be awkward to get it out of the way, but if you remove the gearbox bottom mounting bolt, and, the crossmember bolts on the passenger side. You can use a lever to prise down the crossmember just enough allowing you to slide out the drive shaft.
Disconnect the oil temp sensor from the sump, unplug the crank sensor fly lead and remove the large black grommet from the sensor housing. You might have to remove the turbo drain pipe, but you should be able to very carefully flex it's corrugated section to one side, once the connection to the turbo has been released. You can remove the turbo support brackets but I'm not convinced this is of much help really.
Now you need to get the camera into the sensor housing so you can see what you are dealing with. You will see the torx bolt holding the sensor. If it's damaged take a screen shot and post it here before proceeding further. If it's OK you will need a long torx bit, around 100mm or thereabouts. Undo the torx bolt carefully and withdraw the sensor with the bolt. DO NOT ATTEMPT TO REMOVE THE BOLT ON IT'S OWN. If you drop it the gearbox must come out to retrieve it!! Also note the orientation of the sensor as you remove it, this will help you relocate it more easily.
Replace the sensor and tighten it to 5Nm, reconnect the fly lead, temp sensor, and the turbo drain. Refit the drive shaft paying attention to the marks you made earlier. Use new bolts for the drive shaft as the old ones will snap when you attempt to torque them. Fit a new turbo drain gasket if you have disconnected it. Jack the diff back into position and refit the side mount bolts to the marks you made earlier and the support bracket. Refit the crossmember and gearbox mount bolts. I think the torx bolt holding the crank sensor is a T25, but the new ones are a different size, so best to have a set of bits available cheap from Amazon etc.
I think that should cover most of it and apologies if I've missed something. Good luck.
yµ (idµ - eAµ) ψ=mψ
6th May 2024 12:52 pm
Discobob!!!
Member Since: 08 Mar 2024
Location: Manchester
Posts: 23
Ok with some jiggery pokery the sensor is in but my god did i have a nightmare and a heart in my throat moment which took me 3 hours to solve.
So i got it in place, did the bolt and then thought like an idiot, lets just ratchet one more time and snap!! The head came off, the land rover gods were looking down on my as the head stayed on the end and didn’t fall into the dark abyss. So then getting the rest out, i tried all sorts and the thing that worked was jamming a E5 bit onto the end sticking out and it moved and came out. So the new one is in and tightened by hand said it only needed 5lbs so I recon thats just a bit more than hand tight so it will be sweet and doesn’t move.
So fired it up after clearing the codes and still misfires. I swapped all the injectors over and reprogrammed them to see if the misfire moved with the injector and it didn’t so I’m back to square one of not knowing what the hell is causing this problem.
It starts first time every time now but just misfires to hell.
I use my mates snap on solous legend scanner so Its decent enough and the only codes im getting are the fan because its off and the driver EGR because i blanked it and disconnected the cable but thats been done for a while so nothing newer that might be causing it.
Any recommendations? Ive checked the timing 3 times and with the tool in the back behind the starter, the front 2 cam bolts fit right in.
Could the timing be off somehow and other than checking it that way, how else can i ensure the timing is correct?
11th May 2024 5:19 pm
PROFSR G
Member Since: 06 Mar 2017
Location: Lost
Posts: 5040
Could be a damaged piston caused by a defective injector? The clue would be an injector fault code but it may still be faulty without one. The only way to rule this out is to remove each injector one by one, and again use an endoscope to see if a piston has melted.
Seems odd you have no engine fault codes and it's behaving so badly.yµ (idµ - eAµ) ψ=mψ
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and if you didn't already, you'll have a very definite appreciation for the surgeons who do this day in day out!
