garrycol
Member Since: 06 Dec 2010
Location: Canberra
Posts: 1130
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| Nulon Replacement For Lifeguard 6 ATF - Australia |
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In Australia has anyone started using the Nulon Multi Auto ATF in their gearboxes.
http://www.nulon.com.au/support/specifications-list/198/
It is listed as a straight replacement for the specified Lifeguard 6 ATF. It costs about the same as engine oil s cheap enough to do a basic gearbox oil change every service at 12,000km.
Yes I am very aware of the possible issues in switching from Lifeguard 6 so I am mainly interested in comments from anyone who has long term experience with the Nulon product.
Thanks
Garry
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 2nd Apr 2015 9:13 am |
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jg7
Member Since: 02 Jan 2012
Location: Qld
Posts: 8
 
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I have been running Gulf Western Syn 10 ATF for the last 30,000ks with no problems and for the price difference, I am already ahead if I had to do another flush now, which I don't.
It is listed as a suitable alternative on the GW website and is used by a lot of the Ford Performance guys in their upgraded turbos with ZFs, so would appear to have the necessary staying power.
I noticed that the shifts seemed to hook up quicker and smoother (but this is compared to the very deteriorated fluid that was in there).
Recommend that you do the gearbox reset after the fluid change, as well.
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| 6th Apr 2015 6:49 am |
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garrycol
Member Since: 06 Dec 2010
Location: Canberra
Posts: 1130
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Thanks for the information but I would prefer not to use Gulf Western oils.
Cheers
Garry
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| 6th Apr 2015 10:45 am |
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Sc0tt
Member Since: 03 Aug 2014
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 43
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Just my 2c, but since you can get lifeguard 6 from repco for $30 a litre, why risk it? $180 for 6 litres and you are all set for a filter change or quick flush.
Regards
Scott
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| 12th Apr 2015 11:22 am |
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garrycol
Member Since: 06 Dec 2010
Location: Canberra
Posts: 1130
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Hi Scott - you must have a special Repco as their list price is $38 a litre plus shipping if it is not carried in stock.
But yes have considered that but to ultimately replace all the oil in the gearbox is going to cost more than $180.
I had heard some good things about the Nulon but not personally come across anyone who has been using it.
Cheers
Garry
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| 12th Apr 2015 11:30 am |
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Sc0tt
Member Since: 03 Aug 2014
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 43
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Hey Gary
I just asked for trade price and they were happy to give it to me. I agree it is more than 6 litres for a full flush. But for my purposes, a drain and fill, it is more than adequate and not worth trialling other oils.
Regards
Scott
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| 12th Apr 2015 12:11 pm |
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Rich84
Member Since: 25 Jun 2013
Location: South Australia
Posts: 238
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Bumping an older thread - I'll be due for another flush in about 15K and was thinking about using the Nulon oil. It lists ZF Lifeguard 6 as one of its suitabilities. Last time it took 12L of LG6 to get an appreciable improvement in the colour of my trans fluid, and I'm not keen to spend another $360 on trans oil if this works, so I may give it a go.
My trans certainly didn't like the Penrite oil however, so I'll be watching it closely. 2008 RRS TDV6 - Chawton White/Black/Lined Oak - 20's, h/k, sunroof - 350K KM.
2010 Audi A6 3.0T S-Line - Phamtom Black/exclusive 2-tone valcona 184K
2000 Audi A4 avant 1.8t Q Sport - Phantom Black/black 385K KM
1990 Nissan Pintara TRX - red - lots of mods - 439K KM
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| 19th Jun 2015 6:30 am |
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garrycol
Member Since: 06 Dec 2010
Location: Canberra
Posts: 1130
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Hi Rich - I have the metal sump kit sitting on my kitchen floor waiting to go in. I would like to use the Nulon and do a basic ATF change every 12000km when I do my engine oil change = so would cost about $75 for engine oil and about the same for Nulon ATF. By doing a basic change every 12000km the oil will remain fresh and not increase serviceing costs by all that much.
My only concern is that Nulon say that it should not be mixed with LG 6 which should be fully drained before going to the Nulon which will be a real pain to achieve - I would like to discuss this aspect with the Nulon technicians before I make a final decision.
Garry
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| 19th Jun 2015 6:48 am |
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Rich84
Member Since: 25 Jun 2013
Location: South Australia
Posts: 238
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If that's true, the only way to truly do a dry fill is to remove the trans and empty the torque converter... Otherwise you're just draining a gradually diminishing amount of old fluid and a gradually increasing amount of new fluid each time you dump the oil.
I think if you flushed with 20L of new fluid you'd be pretty close to removing 100% of the old oil, but by the time you do that, you may as well have just paid for the LG6...
I think your idea of doing a single flush at every service is probably a pretty good strategy for ongoing trans maintenance... may look at doing that myself... 8) 2008 RRS TDV6 - Chawton White/Black/Lined Oak - 20's, h/k, sunroof - 350K KM.
2010 Audi A6 3.0T S-Line - Phamtom Black/exclusive 2-tone valcona 184K
2000 Audi A4 avant 1.8t Q Sport - Phantom Black/black 385K KM
1990 Nissan Pintara TRX - red - lots of mods - 439K KM
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| 21st Jun 2015 10:59 pm |
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garrycol
Member Since: 06 Dec 2010
Location: Canberra
Posts: 1130
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I spoke to Nulon today and the guy seemed to know all about our particular gearbox. Even though the front page of the website says
Automatic Transmission Fluids : notations
* Recommended not to mix with other ATF fluids.
# Dry fill recommended
The technician said there are no issues and it is fully compatible with LG6.
He was more concerned that I did not have a OBD2 reader to ensure the gearbox temperature and new fluid was not correct (35-50°c). I explained that I did not have a reader but would use my IR temp gauge and go for a temp of about 40-45°c to ensure an errors would be still be required range. To get the new oil to the required temp range I am going to leave it in my kitchen oven for an hour or so before hand ensuring it is at the right temperature.
So for me this information means I will change to the Nulon oil but I will be doing a basic change every 1000km for two further changes to get most of the old LG6 out and then every 12,000km.
This will still be far cheaper than using LG6 at ZF bulk prices.
Garry
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| 22nd Jun 2015 2:37 am |
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Rich84
Member Since: 25 Jun 2013
Location: South Australia
Posts: 238
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Keen to see how you go with the Nulon as I can get it very well priced through a family member.
I always use the 'rule of finger' method - when the fluid is the right temperature you can't feel it on your finger (aside from a slight oiliness).
Not incredibly technical and I'm sure the Nulon guy would not approve.
-However- I've done three changes over the 100k km I've owned the car - and the trans shifts better now at 232k than when I bought it. 8) 2008 RRS TDV6 - Chawton White/Black/Lined Oak - 20's, h/k, sunroof - 350K KM.
2010 Audi A6 3.0T S-Line - Phamtom Black/exclusive 2-tone valcona 184K
2000 Audi A4 avant 1.8t Q Sport - Phantom Black/black 385K KM
1990 Nissan Pintara TRX - red - lots of mods - 439K KM
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| 22nd Jun 2015 3:42 am |
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Rich84
Member Since: 25 Jun 2013
Location: South Australia
Posts: 238
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I notice that ZF Lifeguard 6 is no longer listed as a key spec for the Nulon ATF on their website... could it be people have been having issues with it? I was going to use it for my next change which is now due, but in this case I may go for LG6 again until I get a clearer picture of what's going on.
I notice that Ford Mercon SP however, which is just LG6 rebranded, is still listed as a key spec.  2008 RRS TDV6 - Chawton White/Black/Lined Oak - 20's, h/k, sunroof - 350K KM.
2010 Audi A6 3.0T S-Line - Phamtom Black/exclusive 2-tone valcona 184K
2000 Audi A4 avant 1.8t Q Sport - Phantom Black/black 385K KM
1990 Nissan Pintara TRX - red - lots of mods - 439K KM
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| 15th Dec 2015 12:51 am |
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garrycol
Member Since: 06 Dec 2010
Location: Canberra
Posts: 1130
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I am not sure I follow as ZF6 is not a spec but a type of oil. If you mean TE-MIL-11 then that is not on the Nulon specs for ZF oils.
Garry
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| 15th Dec 2015 2:25 am |
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garrycol
Member Since: 06 Dec 2010
Location: Canberra
Posts: 1130
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I just rang Nulon and they assure me their is a match but when I asked why it does not match TE-MIL-11 the tech became very evasive and said that was using a different data base.
I suggested Nulon needed to update their spec compatibility listing on the website but he said it was correct and then became very evasive and soon hung up.
Hmm something to hide maybe.
Thanks for the heads up - I still haven't done my gearbox as my second car is off the road and I do not want to do this work without another vehicle at the ready.
In view of this information on compatibility of oil I might have to rethink this option.
Garry
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| 15th Dec 2015 2:43 am |
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Rich84
Member Since: 25 Jun 2013
Location: South Australia
Posts: 238
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TE-ML-11 is a class of oils, which ZF LG6 falls under - however not just any TE-ML-11 will work in the 6HP - the only specified oil is LG6. Ie, TE-ML-11 includes manual transmissions and differentials as well, for which LG6 would not be appropriate.
I didn't know this 3 years ago - Penrite SIN ATF listed TE-ML-11 as a key spec, so I used it myself with frankly, scary results. I later found out that Penrite had issued documentation that specifically listed ZF 6 and 8 speeders as incompatible with Penrite SIN ATF (initially it was their recommended oil for this box), and that ZF's only specified oil for the 6HP26 is LG6, although there are spin-offs of LG6, ie Shell ML 1375.4 and Ford Mercon SP which are identical.
Nulon's website definitely listed "Lifeguard 6" specifically under the ZF section of their compatibility chart. Now they do not. Last time I checked it about 6 months ago it was still there, and if you check the oil specification tool, it still recommends Nulon SYN ATF for the RRS. They also listed it on the actual oil containers themselves. Next time I'm at my brother's work (Supercheap) I will check the chart and get a photo if I can, hopefully his stock is old enough to still have it on the label.
On the back of this I was prepared to try it, thinking if it causes any problems I have a good solid case on which to go back to them if something were to go wrong with my trans. Seems that is now out the window!
Very interested to find out why this transmission is so peculiar that noone can successfully manufacture a non-specific oil that works properly in it.
It sounds like Nulon needs to remove Mercon SP as a key spec too, because the only boxes Mercon SP is spec'ed in is Fords with the ZF 6HP trans or the Ford 6R60 which is a ZF 6HP license built by Ford. 2008 RRS TDV6 - Chawton White/Black/Lined Oak - 20's, h/k, sunroof - 350K KM.
2010 Audi A6 3.0T S-Line - Phamtom Black/exclusive 2-tone valcona 184K
2000 Audi A4 avant 1.8t Q Sport - Phantom Black/black 385K KM
1990 Nissan Pintara TRX - red - lots of mods - 439K KM
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| 15th Dec 2015 3:18 am |
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