But I feel it’s time to start afresh. I was reporting a problem with my new D4 HSE smoking excessively when pulling away from a standstill (and now, at kick-down on the motorway too). Not satisfied with my dealer’s response that “All big Land Rover diesels smokeâ€, I photographed my car’s nasty habit and sent the pictures to the Land Rover Customer Relationship Centre.
At this stage Land Rover were very honest with me, admitting they had an issue with their new TDV6 engine. But rather than post anything further online, I kept these rather powerful images to myself in the hope Land Rover would resolve my problem quickly.
Three months on – and I’ve lost patience. Of course, I was aware Land Rover has a certain stigma in the industry for reliability issues, and in moving away from back-to-back faultless BMWs I knew I was taking a risk. But I really hoped my first experience with the marque would prove me wrong. Not to be…
So what’s wrong?
I’m a steady driver, doing a mix of urban commuting and long-distance motorway runs for business. On occasions I find there is a need to accelerate from standstill fairly rapidly – particularly in the rush hour, at busy T-junctions and roundabouts. However, when I do, my D4 has a tendency to cloud the vehicle behind in horrid blue smoke. And I’ve had enough of other motorists and pedestrians looking at me in disgust and giving me ‘two fingers’!
This is NOT what I expected from a Euro IV engine in a January 2010 model car. And please don’t anyone try and tell me all big diesels smoke – I work in transport industry, and our modern 44 tonners don’t smoke like my D4 does. It goes without saying that I don’t think ANY amount of money could offset my cars carbon emissions.
The evidence
What did Land Rover do?
So on receipt of my photos, Land Rover called me immediately. They explained very clearly that a D4 should NOT smoke like this. They booked my car in at the dealer and it went in for 48 hours on 20 July. At this point it also needed a 1 litre top-up of oil (no surprise, judging by the volume of blue smoke). This was followed by an acknowledgment from Land Rover that there have been reports of issues with 3.0 litre TDV6 engine on select vehicles in different market countries – a problem they believed to be related to the secondary turbocharger. I was told a software upgrade for the engine was needed, and was being written by their engineers. It was due in 4-6 weeks.
Four weeks later, in late-August, Land Rover proactively called me to say the upgrade still wasn’t ready, but they’d take my car in and clean out the engine. This, they assured me, should give me a few thousands miles of smoke-free motoring. They had the car for six days, but the evening I got it back, I took this photograph:
The next morning I sent this to Land Rover, and this time they wanted the car back again for a full week. Their Customer Relationship Centre explained to me that a ‘Land Rover regional engineer’ would be visiting the dealer to check my vehicle in person. I gave up my D4 the following week, but no regional engineer ever visited. The dealer told me they were unaware one was ever going to, and all they could do was clean out the engine again (which has no effect). They told me they felt that Land Rover had jumped to get the car back in, having seen my photograph, and were at a loss what to do other than carry out the same inspection and clean, and report the findings to Land Rover.
I’ve asked Land Rover’s Customer Relationship centre why no regional engineer visited – when that was the purpose of giving up my car for a further week – but no one provided an answer.
So will my D4 quit smoking?
The latest update from the dealer is that Land Rover are now working on either a mechanical or electrical upgrade which they expect to have in October or November. Land Rover claimed in an email to me today that an upgrade is due by the end of October. However, the first deadline for a fix has long passed, so no one could blame me for having little confidence in this timescale!
I’ve been hugely patient, and not created a fuss, but telling me they wanted a LR regional technician to inspect my vehicle and then not bothering to send one has riled me.
I’ve asked for a new engine, but Land Rover has told me replacing the engine will have little effect, as I’d develop the same problem. Which leads me to one question – why aren’t all D4s smoking to this degree? It can’t be good for the environment, and I don’t believe my driving style is any different to most other owners. I also only use high quality fuel.
If only they’d fix my car, then I’d go back to loving the D4. But the way it currently is, it's totally unacceptable and not befitting of a vehicle costing this much.
I’m losing patience with Land Rover and am on the verge of resorting to Nicorette patches on the bonnet.
Admin note: this post has had its images recovered from a money grabbing photo hosting site and reinstated 747_JK
"Moab is my happy place"
2019 Land Rover Discovery 5 HSE
2015 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE - SOLD
2010 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE with a serious smoking habit - SOLD
Last edited by 747_JK on 27th Sep 2010 7:47 pm. Edited 1 time in total
27th Sep 2010 7:13 pm
Gareth Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26776
From the sound of it, you have been extremely patient. Maybe, unfortunately, the only way to get someone to sit up and take charge of the issue is by legal means. Have you asked for the car to be replaced? I think they have had more than enough opportunity to rectify the problem. Small claims court maybe your best bet?
27th Sep 2010 7:25 pm
747_JK
Member Since: 03 Apr 2010
Location: Surrey
Posts: 268
Yes I have Gareth. I have also written to a leading car magazine currently running a long-term D4 test vehicle today too. I actually emailed my proposed letter to the LR Customer Relationship Centre this morning, asking them kindly to either replace my engine, or swap my 9 month old D4 for one which doesn't smoke. They replied this afternoon saying:
"Thank you for your email. I certainly understand your frustration with this matter and agree it is not an acceptable situation, however, I would like to assure you that any actions that we have taken to date have been in good faith.
I have liaised with our technical department today who have advised that our engineers are aware of this concern and a resolution is expected at the end of October 2010, should this be sooner we will contact you without delay.
We do appreciate your patience in this matter and please be assured I will continue to liaise with our engineers periodically and update you accordingly."747_JK
"Moab is my happy place"
2019 Land Rover Discovery 5 HSE
2015 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE - SOLD
2010 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE with a serious smoking habit - SOLD
27th Sep 2010 7:30 pm
Winger Site Moderator
Member Since: 15 Feb 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 3428
You obviously have a problem, of that there is no question.
But, the title of your post needs changing: Be warned: There IS a problem with my 3.0 litre TDV6 engine!
Mine does not smoke like that; if it were down to software, then most likely all engines would smoke; you should now take the legal route and insist upon a replacement engine.
27th Sep 2010 7:44 pm
747_JK
Member Since: 03 Apr 2010
Location: Surrey
Posts: 268
I have changed the title, to play nice. But let's be fair - Land Rover has told me several times that changing my engine is no use, as I will develop the same problem with the new one. I therefore understand the problem is NOT down to my engine alone - and potentially, therefore, others too?
I'm already in regular email contact with another UK owner with the same problem. So it seems unlikely this is specific to my car.747_JK
"Moab is my happy place"
2019 Land Rover Discovery 5 HSE
2015 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE - SOLD
2010 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE with a serious smoking habit - SOLD
27th Sep 2010 7:50 pm
Bodsy Site Sponsor
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That's definately not right. It's usually quite difficult to get smoke from a Disco to show up like that in photo's so you have every right to comlain. I think you've been incredibly patient..... Bodsys Brake Bible
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27th Sep 2010 7:53 pm
grzesiul
Member Since: 11 May 2008
Location: UK
Posts: 6405
do you rev it a lot to get a smoke like that or does it happen no matter what speed engine is running at?
27th Sep 2010 7:56 pm
PSC
Member Since: 01 May 2006
Location: Johannesburg
Posts: 255
747_JK,
Does it smoke heavily if you do the test back to back ?
Is your oil level correct ? I am not sure if the electronic guage in the D4 indicates overfill though (or is it possibly misreading) ?
Should be fairly easy for the Dealer to check if the engine is picking up oil via the intake - the oil should be coating the inside of the intake plumbing - not sure where the crancase vents into (probably before the turbo(s))
27th Sep 2010 7:59 pm
747_JK
Member Since: 03 Apr 2010
Location: Surrey
Posts: 268
grzesiul wrote:
do you rev it a lot to get a smoke like that or does it happen no matter what speed engine is running at?
As above, it mostly happens when pulling away promptly at a T-junction or roundabout (i.e. when its busy and when you need a bit of gas to get out into the flow of traffic). And by that I don’t mean putting my foot flat on the floor!
I live near a steep section of dual carriageway, which I have to pull out onto daily in the rush hour. Getting 2.7 tonnes moving fairly rapidly on a steep hill requires some acceleration, so it happens there almost every time.
Not wanting to risk a family member standing in the middle of a busy junction, I simulated these shots in a quiet residential road.747_JK
"Moab is my happy place"
2019 Land Rover Discovery 5 HSE
2015 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE - SOLD
2010 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE with a serious smoking habit - SOLD
27th Sep 2010 8:03 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
Do you let the engine warm up while stationary ?21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
27th Sep 2010 8:05 pm
747_JK
Member Since: 03 Apr 2010
Location: Surrey
Posts: 268
PSC wrote:
Does it smoke heavily if you do the test back to back ?
No, and Land Rover know this. We've discussed it frequently. Once per journey, usually - or at least - not in quick succession.747_JK
"Moab is my happy place"
2019 Land Rover Discovery 5 HSE
2015 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE - SOLD
2010 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE with a serious smoking habit - SOLD
27th Sep 2010 8:05 pm
747_JK
Member Since: 03 Apr 2010
Location: Surrey
Posts: 268
DG wrote:
Do you let the engine warm up while stationary ?
Sometimes, yes, whilst waiting for Mrs 747_JK to lock-up and come out to the car. And even when I've sat in the car making some phonecalls for five minutes, and then pulled off, it's still done it.747_JK
"Moab is my happy place"
2019 Land Rover Discovery 5 HSE
2015 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE - SOLD
2010 Land Rover Discovery 4 HSE with a serious smoking habit - SOLD
27th Sep 2010 8:07 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
This is a condensation issue IMO ...if you let the engine tick over while stationary then the gases condense in the cold exhaust and then produce the smoke you are seeing when it reaches temperature 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
27th Sep 2010 8:09 pm
Winger Site Moderator
Member Since: 15 Feb 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 3428
Rich, I think it must be oil. I haven't had to put in a drop of oil since new; the early D3 blocks soaked up oil faster than I can produce it!
Something is clearly wrong; it clearly isn't unique. However, when you think of all the 3.0V6 engines in D4s and also in Jaguar XFs, then it cannot be generic. Hence my comment about software.
What's needed is a proper engineer, not a software geek. LR should, at least, agree to fit a complete new engine, including turbo etc. I cannot for the life of me think why they say that this won't cure it. Something is not right, that's for sure.....
27th Sep 2010 8:18 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50978
take your point John ...but it only happens once per journey .. or am I reading it wrong 21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021
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.. or am I reading it wrong 
