DISCO4.COM - View topic - [Mechanical] Suspension Compressor Failure

MVS

Member Since: 18 Jul 2005
Location: People's Republic of Yorkshire
Posts: 419

How many's that Woody? Six,Seven?

Are trading standards or LRCS involved in the deal to change?

Mike

23rd Sep 2005 11:58 am

WOODY179

Member Since: 01 Jun 2005
Location: Chesterfield
Posts: 3654

I'm now on my sixth compressor Mike. Unfortunately Ive just been out on a drive and I got the suspension fault message accompanied by the chimes and then another message saying normal height only.

Spoke to my Service manager and he said to keep the car for now as long as it can be reset by turning the ignition off and then back on, but he is speaking to the area rep to get the car replaced. LRCS are also involved, I'm currently waiting for a phone call from my salesman regarding the new car. 1996 Discovery 1 300TDI ES Biarritz Blue, sold
1999 Discovery 2 TD5 ES Rioja Red, sold
2002 Discovery 2 TD5 ES Buckingham Blue, sold
2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 HSE Adriatic Blue, sold
2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 HSE Zambezi Silver, sold
2011 Discovery 4 SDV6 HSE Nara Bronze, sold
2016 Volvo XC60 D5 AWD Lux Nav Twilight Bronze, sold
2020 Range Rover Evoque P250 First Edition, Nolita grey, sold
2023 Range Rover Evoque P300e Autobiography, Carpathian grey

23rd Sep 2005 2:43 pm

WOODY179

Member Since: 01 Jun 2005
Location: Chesterfield
Posts: 3654

The dealer principal's just rung me and offered me a brilliant deal for a new one, only problem was that they wanted me to have an 05 model. I said I was prepared to pay a bit but wanted an 06 model. He's just phoned me back to say that LR have agreed to this but the car must be registered this month.

When I hear more Ill let you know. 1996 Discovery 1 300TDI ES Biarritz Blue, sold
1999 Discovery 2 TD5 ES Rioja Red, sold
2002 Discovery 2 TD5 ES Buckingham Blue, sold
2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 HSE Adriatic Blue, sold
2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 HSE Zambezi Silver, sold
2011 Discovery 4 SDV6 HSE Nara Bronze, sold
2016 Volvo XC60 D5 AWD Lux Nav Twilight Bronze, sold
2020 Range Rover Evoque P250 First Edition, Nolita grey, sold
2023 Range Rover Evoque P300e Autobiography, Carpathian grey

23rd Sep 2005 3:03 pm

BN

Member Since: 18 Mar 2005
Location: Here
Posts: 6463

WOODY179 wrote:
The dealer principal's just rung me and offered me a brilliant deal for a new one, only problem was that they wanted me to have an 05 model. I said I was prepared to pay a bit but wanted an 06 model. He's just phoned me back to say that LR have agreed to this but the car must be registered this month. When I hear more Ill let you know.

Amasing, even though they are in a corner, the old quota thing comes in again

23rd Sep 2005 3:07 pm

MVS

Member Since: 18 Jul 2005
Location: People's Republic of Yorkshire
Posts: 419

Isn't it amazing what a salesman will do at the end of a lean month!

Mike

Best of luck with it, I'm waitin till Monday to hear back from dealer principle, If they offer me any sort of deal I'll be going back to a Defender I think

23rd Sep 2005 6:32 pm

blue meanie
D3 Decade

Member Since: 04 Aug 2005
Location: Newbury
Posts: 6861

2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 SE Manual Cairns Blue

from my very recent experience there seem to be some jaw-dropping deals available if you're ready to buy before the end of the month, too late for me, mine's at the dealer for collection later this week!

and theeeeennn......???

23rd Sep 2005 7:39 pm

MVS

Member Since: 18 Jul 2005
Location: People's Republic of Yorkshire
Posts: 419

Theory on the failures

Eureka moment last night. Please feel free to pick holes in this?

Compressor seems to fail because working too hard to maintain the vehicle level either in normal driving, or changing height.

This suggests 1 of 2 things:

1. Leak in the system- Many dealers have checked this and it seem not to be present. But this is a static pressure test.

2. Lack of capacity in the system- hence the pump working overtime and failing.

I am a dentist and we use 2 compressors 10hrs a day six days a week, and they need draining of the water they compress out of atmosheric air. Usually I do this once a week (they are big recievers).How does the susp reciever drain its water?

If the reciever is not being drained, capacity is lost hence the pump itself working overtime and going south.

The system surely loses pressure to a small degree in normal driving

If I am correct in assuming this, and the resevoir cannot replenish the relavant corner bag's air fast enough would this not cause the suspension errors that so many people are suffering from.

Over to BN, Winger, & TFC for your critique

Mike

29th Sep 2005 9:15 am

MarkAG

Member Since: 11 Sep 2005
Location: Reading, UK
Posts: 8

Folks

Lancaster Land Rover have given me back my Disco with a "Modified Compressor". So far the problem has NOT reoccured but as I as JUST about to reject the car - I am waiting with baited breath for it to happen.

If it does I reject the car!

The expression "Modified compressor" seems to imply much sense in your theory - maybe it has been upgraded ???

I will keep you informed!!!

29th Sep 2005 9:36 am

Pelyma

Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Patching, Sussex
Posts: 15496

LR are certainly on their 3rd type of compressor. The water in the compressor is a possibility I know of someone whose D2 compressor failed and I think they said the insides of it were wet and rusty. But I'm not techy so couldn't comment but I'm sure the others will

DS3 TDV6 HSE - Silver with Alpaca (old one) Gone
DS3 TDV6 HSE- Silver with Alpaca (new one) Gone
D4 HSE Lux - Montalcino Red Gone
Porsche Cayenne V8 Diesel S

29th Sep 2005 10:14 am

Winger
Site Moderator

Member Since: 15 Feb 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 3428

2016 Discovery 4 3.0 TDV6 HSE Auto Aintree Green

Re: Theory on the failures

MVS wrote:
Eureka moment last night. Please feel free to pick holes in this?

Compressor seems to fail because working too hard to maintain the vehicle level either in normal driving, or changing height.

This suggests 1 of 2 things:

1. Leak in the system- Many dealers have checked this and it seem not to be present. But this is a static pressure test.

2. Lack of capacity in the system- hence the pump working overtime and failing.

I am a dentist and we use 2 compressors 10hrs a day six days a week, and they need draining of the water they compress out of atmosheric air. Usually I do this once a week (they are big recievers).How does the susp reciever drain its water?

If the reciever is not being drained, capacity is lost hence the pump itself working overtime and going south.

The system surely loses pressure to a small degree in normal driving

If I am correct in assuming this, and the resevoir cannot replenish the relavant corner bag's air fast enough would this not cause the suspension errors that so many people are suffering from.

Over to BN, Winger, & TFC for your critique

Mike

Mike,

There is a dryer assembly that bolts onto the compressor; it is a separate part, and I do not know if these are being replaced when a compressor is replaced, or not; I suspect not. That is where the air is dried - it is self draining. I agree, that if this fails to operate, capacity would be lost over time. Easy to check though, just remove plug on the receiver and see if water comes out! (Don't try this at home....)

The compressor failures may result from overwork, or could me simply dodgy manufacture. There are many D3s out there that have compressors of the failing variety fitted that are working fine at the moment. We tried to get together some information that might have pointed to a particular VIN range/manufacture period to see if there was any correlation to the failures, but that attempt failed, or I haven't seen the results (Martin?).

So, they could either be failing because they are naff, or failing because they are naff but not naff enuff (I like that!) to fail unless they are being overworked because there is another fault. The only two reasons that I can think of that would make them overwork, in addition to reduced capacity due to a dryer failure, are a faulty pressure cut-off switch or a leak in the system. If you look back to some posts from another epoch, you will see that I suggested parking in a pond and looking for bubbles - and I was half-way serious. Leaks are very hard to detect, unless very obvious, and even more so when you are actually driving.

The system does lose pressure when driving as the air suspension rises and falls under normal road conditions. Surplus air is vented, not returned to the receiver, and when the receiver pressure falls below a preset level, the compressor cuts in - nothing controversial there.

I agree with you that a compressor that is still working, just, could result in random low air pressure errors - probably culminating in a total failure. This may account for some of problems that are being experienced. However, levelling sensors are also susceptible to errors - go look at where they are and what they are, you will see what I mean.

The danger we get into is discussions like this is that we are not furnished with all the relevant facts, the context or, indeed, the driver's knowledge of the more complex vehicle functions. Trying to diagnose faults on the Forum is very hit and miss, frankly.

In summary, I would say that there are some problems caused by compressor failures; I am at a loss as to explain how some owners are going through so many compressors unless the explanation is that the compressors being fitted are faulty, or the dealer has totally missed a more fundamental problem - most likely a leak - in the system. You can hear the compressor running when driving (not at motorway speed, I admit). Mine does not operate very much. I suspect that, under normal driving conditions, the demand for air is not that great - lots of cornering, though, will result in greater use of the air supply....so, are those people who have compressor failures doing more A/B road driving than multi-carriageway driving? Would be interesting to know.

I don't think that it is possible to come up with a simple, single explanation as to the root cause. There are just too many other variables to take into account, and remember that the problems affect the minority, not the majority. What we do know is the LR themselves have acknowledged that the earlier compressor was not up to scratch, and changed the design/part. I'd be most surprised, therefore, if recent build cars are having compressor problems unless this is being caused by something else.

Finally, whilst I hate to say it, often you can get a problem with a vehicle fixed by going over in your own mind exactly what you have, Mike; then discuss that with the service manager. I can think of three occasions over the years where faults with vehicles have been rectified as a result of what I suggested the dealer to look for, rather than what they thought they should be looking for!

29th Sep 2005 10:30 am

blue meanie
D3 Decade

Member Since: 04 Aug 2005
Location: Newbury
Posts: 6861

It has been suggested to me that there may be a wiring harness routing issue involved in the compressor failure scenario, if that helps! and theeeeennn......???

29th Sep 2005 3:45 pm

MVS

Member Since: 18 Jul 2005
Location: People's Republic of Yorkshire
Posts: 419

Winger, I agree with your extensive description that my suggestion is possibly over simplified, and may be one of multiple factors.

Wiring, dodgy, parts, poor placement of parts, software??, or as you suggest possible small leaks that are v. diff to detect.

Funnily enough the second comp failure reared its head first as Bong: susp error, when going fairly quickly round a bend (I'm following round the same one slowly) at 50 mph.

I have suggested to dealer service dept, and dealer principle this morning my thoughts, and they are going to look tomorrow AM.

I agree that it usually takes your own personal thought and provocation to get dealers to solve issues as many are too busy to stop and think.

Case in point. I had a vibration which appeared after 1000 ish miles, which they coudn't find. I did eventually. The spare wheel carrier had worked slightly loose and the wheel was rattling against the undercarriage, but oly just. Dealer now checks this on all new D3's at PDI, cos I let them know.

Mike

P.S.Thanks for the info on the dryer, these are availble on dental comps from Jun air, Bambi et al but can be notoriously unreliable.

29th Sep 2005 4:39 pm

BN

Member Since: 18 Mar 2005
Location: Here
Posts: 6463

I must say Wingers comments re the air make me think about the problem of where they are located, length ways front to back and in line with the wheels. If water is sprayed onto them and they are warm moisture could possibly condense inside.

29th Sep 2005 6:53 pm

Gareth
Site Moderator

Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26774

Pelyma wrote:
LR are certainly on their 3rd type of compressor. The water in the compressor is a possibility I know of someone whose D2 compressor failed and I think they said the insides of it were wet and rusty. But I'm not techy so couldn't comment but I'm sure the others will

It was me who had a D2 compressor go west. I took it apart and it was full of water and rust. The dryer is a cylinder full of silica gel crystals. These absorb moisture, as the air passes through.

29th Sep 2005 7:05 pm

Winger
Site Moderator

Member Since: 15 Feb 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 3428

BriaN,

If the sensors have manufacturing assembly faults, then I think there is a concern. That said, they've been around on Range Rovers and DIIs (ACE) for a while. I had one replaced on the last Discovery after only a very few miles, after that no problem.....just got the amber suspension warning light (sound familiar?).

If you've got a dodgy one, I think water could well play a part in a failure. It is only a very simple switch though.

29th Sep 2005 7:10 pm