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Tony686
Member Since: 23 Oct 2007
Location: Essex
Posts: 636
  
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stapldm
Just seen your reply. will test it on the way home. I have never pulled the lever whilst in motion. Front pads are worn but ok and passed the MOT the rears wee replaced 15,000 miles ago, but are you saying the rears have drums also (brake shoes)? I have never noticed.
TACK CLUB DEFNER
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 13th May 2009 5:22 pm |
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NoDo$h
Member Since: 02 May 2006
Location: Finding new and exciting ways to milk badgers.
Posts: 19689
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don't test it with anything behind you! Your car will stop far quicker than you might think possible. I know it's not considered "kind" to say no these days, but no. Just no, ok? And if it's not ok, still no.
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| 13th May 2009 5:49 pm |
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stapldm
Member Since: 11 Sep 2006
Location: Swine Town
Posts: 2330
 
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That's right Tack, the rear wheels have disc/pads for the footbrake and drums/shoes for the park brake.
When you apply the parkbrake whilst moving (and it's designed to be used like this in an emergency), the car starts by using the ABS system to apply your footbrake for you (all 4 wheels) and as Nodo$h said it's a real treat! Definitely not for a road with any other vehicles about!
When the speed drops below about 3MPH, then the park brake is applied instead and that is used to bring the car to a halt (or it will halt if the shoes/pads are serviceable). Dr. Ian Malcolm:
"Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should."
Transgenic tomato anyone?
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| 13th May 2009 6:32 pm |
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Tony686
Member Since: 23 Oct 2007
Location: Essex
Posts: 636
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Thanks stapldm
Tested it twice. Driving approx 40-50mph. Both times exactlly the same results.
The dash pinged up a warning re the brake being applied and the vehicle slowed to a halt with me keeping the handbrake lever pulled up. The vehicle did not aggressivly stop and there was no indication to me the ABS was doing anything i.e. cutting in at all. The vehicle slowed very slowly, nothing like what a normal hand brake would do. Well a noraml knackered one would do it like it! No Bong Bongs ABS ABS
What now tree of Knowledges?
TACK CLUB DEFNER
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| 13th May 2009 8:39 pm |
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Slimer
Site Moderator
Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Last Exit to Nowhere
Posts: 16295
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The ABS won't normally cut in but it should stop blooming quickly, as quick if not quicker than if you put all your weight on the stop pedal. Sounds like you may have a brake issue, what happens if you try a 'normal' emergency stop using the brake pedal? The End
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| 13th May 2009 9:00 pm |
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stapldm
Member Since: 11 Sep 2006
Location: Swine Town
Posts: 2330
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As Slimer said, a stop from 50 should have had you searching for a dry cleaners to get your shorts sorted out 
When I said ABS I meant you should hear the ABS pump running and feel it hammering the brake pedal if you had your foot on it, as it provides the power for the braking. I didn't mean that the car would skid, it shouldn't.
I'm now wondering if your ABS pump system has a fault and you stopped on the drum/shoes (which I believe is what should happen if the ABS fails). This would explain a graceful stop.
In future when testing brake efficiency issues, can I humbly suggest keeping top speed below 20MPH? 
This is getting over complicated, and as it's starting to look like you do have a brake issue, then it may not be in your safety interests to keep diagnosing this way.
Time to get to a (good!) stealers if you're under warranty, or alternatively one of our forum advertising independents. My own personal choice would be 10forcash in the indy stakes as he seems to have a deeper intimate relationship with the car's internals than anyone else I know. He'll know for sure what's wrong and how to fix it, and what's more he'll come to you. Dr. Ian Malcolm:
"Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should."
Transgenic tomato anyone?
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| 13th May 2009 9:52 pm |
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Davro
Member Since: 30 Jun 2007
Location: London
Posts: 352
 
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Hi Tony,
What about this one that TazDaz mentioned the other night, http://www.lespaulsmotors.co.uk, just give us some warnings and we will put some sandbags out for you in case you can't stop !.
Not tried them myself, as always gone to Beadles, but maybe worth a try.
regards,
Dave
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| 13th May 2009 10:30 pm |
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Tony686
Member Since: 23 Oct 2007
Location: Essex
Posts: 636
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stapldm
Nope, clean pants. No ABS cutting in. Will be trying a specialist local to me, just for a quick get it done, as I really need an MOT!
Dave
Hi Mate, speaking to Les pauls re servicing at the moment as I want to get all the diff and transfer oils done as well as a normal service, but I have made the decision to service the vehicle myself at this point and brought all the parts for the service. They are a bit of a trek for me but I will consider them on the outcome of a few phone calls today. 
TACK CLUB DEFNER
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| 14th May 2009 7:26 am |
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NoDo$h
Member Since: 02 May 2006
Location: Finding new and exciting ways to milk badgers.
Posts: 19689
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Just a thought. Is it possible to put the car into EPB bedding mode, not complete the cycle and leave the car with the EPB incorrectly tensioned?
If so, and this is all conjecture, this might explain why the car failed to pull up on the EPB last night?
If the main braking circuit is suspect, I'd check pads first (not unheard of for them to wear unevenly and not trip the wear sensor), then check the vacuum line for oil contamination. If you're happy with the main brakes then it points towards the EPB not having been reset properly during or after the MOT. If that's the case, a serious kick in the balls to the tester is in order. I know it's not considered "kind" to say no these days, but no. Just no, ok? And if it's not ok, still no.
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| 14th May 2009 7:35 am |
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Tony686
Member Since: 23 Oct 2007
Location: Essex
Posts: 636
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Is it a simple case that the brake shoes/drums needs adjusting or tightning, as I have read other posts refering to this?
TACK CLUB DEFNER
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| 14th May 2009 7:36 am |
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Tony686
Member Since: 23 Oct 2007
Location: Essex
Posts: 636
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NoDosh
Just read your post. Will have a look on the forum re bedding in procedure, the normal brakes are working fine. How would the MOT tester of tested the EPB and would he have been required to reset the EPB?
I am at work now so limited use of internet. Speak and update latter chaps THX CLUB DEFNER
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| 14th May 2009 7:41 am |
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NoDo$h
Member Since: 02 May 2006
Location: Finding new and exciting ways to milk badgers.
Posts: 19689
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Sadly not that simple a process, but in principle, yes. There's been a number of posts on how to reset the EPB tension - a dig around the site should reveal what you need. Posts by 10forcash and Wiggs in particular spring to mind. I know it's not considered "kind" to say no these days, but no. Just no, ok? And if it's not ok, still no.
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| 14th May 2009 7:42 am |
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Gareth
Site Moderator
Member Since: 07 Dec 2004
Location: Bramhall
Posts: 26772
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Hang on chaps, there is a really simple way to see if the epb is capable of holding the car firmly. If you find a reasonably steep slope (multi storey car park ramp for example), put the car in neutral, apply the epb. Does the car roll away or stick firm?
If the car rolls away, then your epb is not working properly, if it holds it firmly, you know the tester got it wrong.
One thing, my last D3 always suffered epb problems, and always needed the switch holding up for a couple of seconds to fully apply the epb. If I just flicked it up, it would creep forward if left in drive. My new D3 does not do this, a quick flick of the switch holds it firmly immediately.
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| 14th May 2009 7:58 am |
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Tony686
Member Since: 23 Oct 2007
Location: Essex
Posts: 636
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Did a bit more testing, hill test, did the bedding in procedure and took back to the MOT centre to ask how they test the vehicle.
In fact they do use a decelerometer and they chap whom tested it, 'before i mentioned to him about the bedding in procedure ' informed me of the procedure and that he had done it a few times yesturday. He seam a fairly clued up guy and new EPB's well. He then offered to test the vehicle with me in it and run throught the bedding in process. We did this and the decelerometer got 20%, therefore the further bedding in and a bit of rough testing has helped matters and therefore its a PASS 
Yeahhhhhhhy.
Thanks guys for your help 
TACK CLUB DEFNER
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| 14th May 2009 11:40 am |
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SJR
Member Since: 09 Aug 2006
Location: East Manchester
Posts: 4030
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20% is some considerable improvement over 12%, and glad it has now passed
BUT
20% still seems a very low number, does anyone know what it is (or can they test) on a new D3 to find out how much deteriation there is from new to 20% .........! I believe that every human has a finite number of heart-beats. I don't intend to waste any of mine running around doing exercises.
Buzz Aldrin (1930 -
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| 14th May 2009 11:53 am |
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