Member Since: 30 Aug 2010
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 4312
How many people refer to citizens of the USA as a Yank? Apparently derives from the Dutch word Janke meaning John.
Now a Canadian citizen will get upset by being called a Yank. However a Yank will refer to a Canadian as a Canuck. I would guess a Canadian would prefer being called a Canuck rather then a Yankee.
Too many people trying to be politically correct?
Now when I first went to university in Yorkshire I was taken aback at first by burly male market traders referring to me as 'love' Not meant as an insult, just a different way of say sir, mister in an informal way such as mate etc.
Just had a look at definition of the word 'Jock' and found this
I asked earlier if it was a “generational thing”. I think it must be.
I was born in 1964 and whilst growing up nicknames relating to where you were from, an abbreviation of your name, a physical characteristic etc. were commonplace. You almost felt excluded if you didn’t have one.
There was never any ill intention, it was common to have several children with the same Christian name in a class or group of friends. In some cases nicknames were simply a way to distinguish one from another
I still know quite a few people only by their nicknames. No idea of their actual names. The same applies to myself.
Today nobody would dream of calling a small boy, who had to wear thick glasses, Goggs. Yet Goggs is still known as that by everyone, even his wife. The same as my friends North, Taff and of course Jockey.
Someone I was at school with is still universally known as "Paedo", he having the bad luck to share his name with that of a paedophile in an episode of Juliet Bravo in the early 80s. Another still gets called "big black pouffe" on occasion - originating from a discussion of furniture in a woodwork lesson in which he said "in the evening, my Dad likes to relax with a big black pouffe", to howls of laughter. The reason there is still an "Acorn" Lowman in the town is down to post-PE showers.
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3rd Jan 2020 4:37 pm
J77
Member Since: 03 Mar 2008
Location: Fife
Posts: 6261
RRSTDV8 wrote:
Our Scottish brothers and sisters use the term sassenach to refer to their English brothers and sisters, don't they? Or is that now old hat too?
Never heard of that.23.5MY Defender 90 X-Dynamic SE D250 MHEV Pangea Green
I believe it is more traditionally pronounced "weebaldysassenachgoawa'anbileyerheid".
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3rd Jan 2020 7:15 pm
Iguana
Member Since: 14 Oct 2013
Location: 'Sunny' Zomerset
Posts: 9402
Taffy.....some think it originated from the Welsh version of David, Daffydd or Taffydd......or after the fiver Taff?
Was used in an old English poem:
Quote:
Taffy was a Welshman, Taffy was a thief;
Taffy came to my house and stole a leg of beef;
I went to Taffy's house and Taffy was in bed;
I upped with the jerry pot and hit him on the head
Used to be called Taff back in the early 90's when working in Bristol, but hardly hear it nowadays
Never really bothered me though Iggy/Ieuan
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3rd Jan 2020 7:53 pm
knwatkins
Member Since: 19 Sep 2018
Location: Poole, Dorset
Posts: 716
Well, being a Welshman I didn't know that. I always thought it was because of the river Taff.
I've been called Taff on numerous occasions. I neither find it offensive or derogatory. In fact, I find it inclusive more than anything!Kev
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3rd Jan 2020 7:58 pm
Someone-Gone
Member Since: 21 Dec 2015
Location: Gone
Posts: 5117
Sassenach is a derogatory term for an English person. It went out of fashion in the 1800’s.
That apart, if you called a person something THEY deem ethnic, racial, religious, you maybe committing an offence. It’s what the recipient interprets it to be, not what the person doling it out thinks. Third parties interpretation also count even if it’s not directed to them.
Food for thought. World we live in. Adapt or die.
If you wouldn’t call a Chinese takeaway premises by the slang of yesteryear or likewise the corner shop, then why do you think it’s okay to use terms for others belonging to a part of the country that may be deemed unacceptable?
3rd Jan 2020 9:46 pm
RRSTDV8
Member Since: 07 Apr 2014
Location: Here
Posts: 13133
I've heard Sassenach used since the 1800s, I can assure you.
Calling you "Jock", or you calling me "Sassenach", is no more an offence than either of us calling the other "snowflake" or "silly Billy" or any other one of a multitude of non-racial, non-religious, non-ethnic names. The Scots aren't a race any more than the English are. Nor is either a religion or a separate ethnic group (although the Irish might be).
If you were Catholic and I called you a "left footer" then you might have a point.
If you're offended, I can only refer you to Mr Fry:
(Caution (to keep the mods happy): contains a swear word)Visiting from rrsport.co.uk
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"When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die! You don't know who's children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they were always going to have to do from the very beginning: SIT DOWN AND TALK!"
3rd Jan 2020 10:01 pm
Someone-Gone
Member Since: 21 Dec 2015
Location: Gone
Posts: 5117
It’s what others perceive it to be, not what you intend it to be.
Do what you like, if you run foul of the law at some point, not appreciating others might not share your view, I am sure you can argue your point to the judge and tell him or her, they are wrong.
Oh and Scots are a race btw, so your argument falls down at the first hurdle. You can also commit an offence by online utterings.
3rd Jan 2020 10:12 pm
leeds
Member Since: 30 Aug 2010
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 4312
The Dundonian wrote:
Sassenach is a derogatory term for an English person. It went out of fashion in the 1800’s.
So the term sassenach went out of fashion in the 1800's?
Sassenach (n.)
Gaelic for "English person," 1771, Sassenaugh, literally "Saxon," from Gaelic Sasunnach, from Latin Saxones, from a Germanic source (such as Old English Seaxe "the Saxons;" see Saxon). The modern form of the word was established c. 1814 by Sir Walter Scott, from Scottish Sasunnoch, Irish Sasanach, Welsh Seisnig
So Sassenach originated from first recorded use in 1771
Quote:
The Herald asserted in 2002 that: ‘BBC Scotland is hoping [the soap opera] River City will be just as long-running as its Sassenach equivalents’. In this instance, ‘Sassenach equivalents’ makes the geographical point more clearly, sidestepping the ambiguities of ‘English equivalents’ which could signify language rather than location. Furthermore, Sassenachis well suited to journalese writing that welcomes any opportunity to evoke a sense of ‘us’ and ‘them’.
Just remind us what The Herald is? Surely not a Scottish newspaper using words that went out of fashion in the 1800s in the 21st Century?
Do Sky1 have exclusive rights to this race? Because I've never watched it. Who's winning this season?
I think you'll find being Scottish, English or Welsh would be defined loosely as an ethnicity at best. To define yourself as a distinct race is really grasping to bolster your rather fragile argument.
A rather thorough paper on the ethnicity classifications for the 2011 census. You'll note that race is mentioned only in passing as one of the broader contributing factors in self-identity.I know it's not considered "kind" to say no these days, but no. Just no, ok? And if it's not ok, still no.
3rd Jan 2020 11:14 pm
Someone-Gone
Member Since: 21 Dec 2015
Location: Gone
Posts: 5117
Be as flippant as you like.
It really doesn’t matter what you think or I for that matter, rather what the law thinks.
I don’t think progressing this argument is going to do any good. You’ve got one opinion and I have another. Probably best left like that tbh.
3rd Jan 2020 11:24 pm
Grianaig
Member Since: 08 Jul 2014
Location: Tyne and Wear
Posts: 1286
I read somewhere that the term “sassenach” included the Scottish Lowlanders as they had fought against the Jacobites at Culloden. It is also defined as lowlander in Chambers Dictionary.2014 MY Discovery XS Indus Silver. Sadly gone. Second last LR of forty eight years continuous ownership.
Last edited by Grianaig on 4th Jan 2020 12:08 am. Edited 1 time in total
4th Jan 2020 12:04 am
kajtzu
Member Since: 11 Aug 2017
Location: Helsinki
Posts: 6581
Jamie calls Claire Sassenach in Outlander I mean, that’s what I’ve been told
4th Jan 2020 12:07 am
LT
Member Since: 31 Dec 2005
Location: South West
Posts: 23409
Iguana wrote:
Taffy.....some think it originated from the Welsh version of David, Daffydd or Taffydd......or after the fiver Taff?
Was used in an old English poem:
Quote:
Taffy was a Welshman, Taffy was a thief;
Taffy came to my house and stole a leg of beef;
I went to Taffy's house and Taffy was in bed;
I upped with the jerry pot and hit him on the head
Used to be called Taff back in the early 90's when working in Bristol, but hardly hear it nowadays
Never really bothered me though
I honestly don’t know Taff’s actual Christian name.
My understanding was that it originated from the river Taff.2006 D3 HSE (Original & still the best)-GONE
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