Member Since: 18 Mar 2007
Location: Dorset
Posts: 5011
Driver Condition Monitor
(= very poor)2005 D3 HSE 2011 D4 Landmark 2016 D4 HSE Lux
2017 Ford Tourneo VR46
Club Waitomo
8th Oct 2016 6:28 am
RRSTDV8
Member Since: 07 Apr 2014
Location: Here
Posts: 13556
sacimiddx wrote:
Its not really a replacement for the D4 at all (there is not any real evolution) - it is in effect a 7 seat FFRR and as such the entry level could be regarded as something of a bargain
The Discovey name a useful marketing tool for LR
I like that summary.Visiting from rrsport.co.uk
2012 RRS SDV6
2008 RRS TDV8
"When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die! You don't know who's children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they were always going to have to do from the very beginning: SIT DOWN AND TALK!"
8th Oct 2016 8:57 am
MHP
Member Since: 31 Dec 2011
Location: lydd
Posts: 2776
DigitalJunior wrote:
When are the first production models due in the dealer showrooms ?
Member Since: 18 Aug 2009
Location: Uppsala
Posts: 65
Yes, very accurate summary by sacimiddx. This was also very true with the change from Discovery 2 to Discovery 3, no real evolution but a all new concept with very much taken from the FFRR design, e.g. the split tailgate!
Must say after have gone over all the videos, press images and full press kit twice and then printed and read the full pricelist a number of times I must admit I'm sold. The D5 is a worthy Discovery replacement, can't wait to see it for real and drive it.
But the utilitarian side seems to be a bit abandoned, but I'm sure this will all be met by the new Defender we all are waiting for. But there are another thing that concerns me, and that's the life span of these new all aluminium vehicles. I'm sure they will age well when it comes to rust and technology, but how fixable are these when they get a dent in a wing or other small bodywork damages. This is one of the main reasons I love the old Discovery 2's, that on these you can DIY replace any panel, chassis or other part!
Anyway, time goes on and also LR must get modern and up to date. Look forward to my first drive of a D5 and also the day sometime in the future when I get to own one.
This was also very true with the change from Discovery 2 to Discovery 3, no real evolution but a all new concept with very much taken from the FFRR design, e.g. the split tailgate!
I kind of disagree here; the Disco 3 was exactly what the Disco has always been from the start - a cheaper, utilitarian alternative to the Range Rover. The Disco and FFRR have always been cut from the same cloth. The difference is in the gap between the two which, IMO, has not fundamentally narrowed until now (each model has become more refined, but up until now, the basic utilitarianism has not been diminished with it). Current: Discovery 3 06MY (55 reg) HSE Auto Zambezi Silver Allisport Fast Road Intercooler, V8 Brakes, Silicone IC Hoses, EGRs Blanked, Remapped, De-Cat pipe, FBHIC
Freelander 2 2007 HSE Manual Tambora Flame
Previous: FL2 56 reg SE Manual Black (written off )
Disco 3 06 reg B7S Manual Rimini Red
Disco 2 TD5 Y reg ES Manual Blue - Chipped
Several Discovery 300 TDis
8th Oct 2016 9:39 am
Russell
Member Since: 23 Aug 2007
Location: Kent
Posts: 10564
Right having now been and seen the new Discovery in the flash and crawled over under and in it here are my views and opinions.
It is lovely to look at and grows on you the more you see it or spend time around it. It is big in all aspects from first vision to spending time in and outside of it. I also saw two on the road yesterday and it clearly stands out from others in my opinion even at 70 mph going the opposite way on the motor way.
Inside and the rear access, the 2nd row seats electrically fold to allow access to the 3rd row as well as sliding. The access is different to a D3/4 but I would not have said any harder, I find the D3/4 easy to catch legs/clothing on the seat mechanism when folded up for access, not so on the D5 although I think there may be slightly less row to get through. This however is overcome by the new 2nd row grab handle.
We (mark and I) both sat in the back with the 2nd row right back and right forward and felt there was enough room and I am 5 11 and Mark is 6 plus. If the 2nd row is slid right forward there is loads of room and still room for 2nd row passengers. The only down side for me was that the foot well was not as deep and your knees were up a bit, this is however over come easily when the 2nd row seats are pulled forward allowing you to stretch out. We would both happily sit in the back for a long journey. I did think it would be claustrophobic with the smaller window but did not find that to be honest.
The seats fold flattish on the initial push of the button and with an additional push squash down flatter to make a nearly level flat floor. It is actually wider at floor level than the D4 and would easily take a double air bed plus. Not sure if I like the electric fold or not. There was however still storage around the head rest area when the 3rd row were folded flat for things like first aid kits, tow strops etc, if the head rests could be removed and I am not sure if they can or not there would be a massive storage area.
There are loads of plug in points for phones and 12v gadgets and there are loads of buttons at all three rows to over seats as well as by your phone if you go for that option. The cubby holes in the boot have gone and the pockets at the top are a lot smaller. Door pockets seemed to D4. Secret cubby hole behind the HVAC controls was a nice touch.
Electrics and instruments are nicely laid out but the speedo and rev counter or a bit like looking into binoculars with their round brinicles, different but you soon get used to them. The 10” display was good, a huge amount on there and a lot to work through. The sat nav seemed quick and clear to program. Surround cameras were clear and good quality and the 360 although old technology was a nice touch. Trailer assist and the bits for towing seem very very good and very useful especially the ability to lower and raise the rear suspension from the boot area when hooking up.
The FBH has gone as standard equipment, however on the high spec models the car can be started whilst locked to warm the car and clear windows……………….. I was told this by different people and also questioned this at the end but all said the same. The FBH can be ordered as an option with remote heat, this then allows the same remote operation as D4’s. Seems a little odd to me.
Engine bay is huge, the 3lt sits lower and much further back than the 2lt and there seems to be loads of space for a second battery in there.
Underneath seemed to be better protected than the D4 with more plates but not sure how substantial they are and if they are more for show. Was told the wading depth was 900 mm and that you could come to a standstill in 900 mm of water, was also told you could drive through deeper providing you kept going and had a bow wave, but would not commit to how deep.
Would I buy one………………. Yes I would, what spec, not sure yetMY17 D5 1st Edition Namib Orange
MY15 D4 HSE Kaikoura Stone
MY12 D4 HSE Nara Bronze Sold and gone
MY11 D4 HSE Stornaway Grey Sold and gone
D3 S spec Silver Sold and gone
Tow bar, full length roof bars, side steps, tow bar storage unit, surround camers.
D4 camera club
8th Oct 2016 12:54 pm
Bergen
Member Since: 18 Oct 2016
Location: Cumbria
Posts: 5
Hard to tell from the promo film what it's like or what its target audience will be.
I really hope LR haven't forgotten about the folk who actually need the capabilities of this vehicle.
We run Defenders as well and their replacement is unlikely to be as rugged and adaptable as the 'original' so I'm concerned that my favourite brand won't be able to satisfy our requirements and there really is nothing else to turn to as a realistic alternative.
Time to huy a galv chassis, TD5 engine & 'box and build our own maybe?
19th Oct 2016 11:14 pm
Red Merle
Member Since: 30 Aug 2014
Location: Liskeard
Posts: 7441
"Hard to tell from the promo film what... its target audience will be"
From the clichéd people in the video, I'd say young, white collar, professional, affluent families; what I find hard to fathom is the differentiation between this target market and those for the rest of the current range.2011 - 2015: 3 x FL2
2015 - 2017: 2 x D4
2017 to date: FFRR SDV8
2023 to date: 2 x FL2 as “second” cars 🙄
2021 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200
2022 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200 & sidecar!
(One of only two known to exist in the world!)
To me the with motor vehicles the new model should eclipse the outgoing model.....should
But the Discovery "large" model 5 clearly doesn't....the LR guy at the look I had today has said that all D3/4 owners have commented on:
Shape of loadspace being hugely compromised by the rounded shape...yes you maybe do not use the complete extent of the cube the 3/4 had...but if it isn't there you simply can't ....so the uses I've made with my D3 doing lots of tasks using the volume capacity are simply not there. What were they thinking about ?
Well obviously not the uses many Disco 3/4's are right now & to me pandering to the needs of those who want 7 seats.....ok I could buy or hire a van....but I bought a Disco 3 that the original concept was a multi use vehicle.
Neither visit I did I had RTÉ tape measure with me but SWMBO'd commented that the 2nd row seats up load space wasn't as usable (bulk volume wise) as our FL2
The activity platform....this is a joke.....it stays up when the tailgate open & when down is about as much use as a chocolate fire guard ....what were they thinking about ?
The absence of the FFRR & previous model Disco lower tailgate this is the very debatable & ineffective answer. If this is a "marketing" compromise it defies the logic of LandRover in being practical & usable.
2nd row seats......unbelievable poor with 5' 11" adults in front seats...."knees up" sitting position - for this class, size, cost of vehicle inexcusable.....in comparison inferior to even a Freelander 2....not a £60 odd grand multi use vehicle.
What were they thinking about...I don't think they were thinking at all...they got the VR or clay model sizes & had to do the best they could making it into a seven seat vehicle regardless of the compromises of 2nd row seat passenger comfort.
OK the shapes different but very much like it's stablemates....little thought on model differentiation.....as said above like a puffed up Freelander 3 / Disco Sport & to me LandRovers are all about using not posing with.
The infotainment system is almost identical to the XF which I've used on some long journies....not that bad, but nowhere near the integration example of VW/Audi & thats at least 4 year old technology on a far lower cost volume car.
It's lighter, more economical, better off road etc etc me it should be as technology & things move on....you sort of expect this....
I just wonder if the eventual Defender replacement will fill the gap that has been left by the demise of the Disco 3/4 ?......i.e a practical reasonably priced multi purpose vehicle that stand head & sholders above the competition as regards capacity load wise, off road / winter driving, towing etc the friendly practical workhorse that can double as a comfortable motorway cruiser.
I suspect many D3/4 owners will now be planning to keep thier vehicles on the road far longer than they originally planned, also be looking elsewhere at other makes that will fill this gap - not as competently maybe but will provide capability & reliability at realistically better cost.
I just can't understand that Jaguar have a very differentiated model range & LR is bunched up at the top with similar models at outrageous prices.
I feel sorry for this who have already ordered to be "1st on the block" with the new Disco 5......whatever ego boost this has will be very short lived when the cost of attaining this is realised in owning a compromised excuse for a new model.
Land Rover should be ashamed......as if this were a vehicle from another maker it would be ridiculed with all its shortcomings.BREXIT - done properly.
Right now ...We need Government - not Politics
Save the Dipstick Flagbearer-keep it simple, less likely to fail campaign-agenda items:Starting Handles, Acetylene Lamps.
Founder: Dipsticks-R-Us Inc
D3 HSE-perfectly formed, passenger friendly...has real DIPSTICK
Jag XK-but sadly no DIPSTICK...HUGE design fault
FL2 has DIPSTICK..."real comfort in rear seats"
VW Golf wondermobile (?)..has real DIPSTICK
Morris Minor..original DIPSTICK technology..and a real KEY.
22nd Oct 2016 5:33 pm
den2013
Member Since: 03 Jan 2013
Location: Alland
Posts: 622
Agree agree agree agree with BLFarrar, I for one am not going to be ordering one, I think its a disgrace to the LR heritage of old, I have said this elsewhere on here a little and also some very angery comments on Instagram when LR started putting it up on there that this car is to far of a leap to the old car and there is nothing individual about it, LR had a shape for a vehicle and now they all look the same old same.
I for one would like to see the D4 updated a lot and then rebadged as a Defender, im sure it will lend itself to being converted to a pick up as well, can't see much trouble putting a bulkhead in, even having to retool a fair bit would surly be cheaper than building a whole new Defender with new equipment to do so.
So, if people want to look around and try to find something else, well have been doing it for a while now and looked at all the normal candidates and really there is nothing out there, yes they can all compete but they are more akin to a car, the seating position is more laid back and they all feel cramped with everything wrapped around you, defiantly not the feeling of a D4, about the only contender is the G Wagon but honestly the price is outrageous, plus the actually driving is not as good as the D4.
So sorry LR, i feel as if you lost another customer with me, I will reserve judgment till the Defender or poss a FFRR but as it stands, Hmmmmmmmmmm 2015 D4 HSE LUX Kaikoura Stone(sold)
2010 D4 S Commercial Santorini Black(SWMBO)(sold)
2014 Evoque Dynamic Kaikoura Stone (sold)
2013 Porsche Boxster S (Fun car)
2008 D3 HSE Java Black(sold)
22nd Oct 2016 6:02 pm
Red Merle
Member Since: 30 Aug 2014
Location: Liskeard
Posts: 7441
What BLFarrar's written there is very interesting. Thanks!
The bit about the 2nd row seating reminds me of the design of the R50 MINI (I used to be very into MINI's and followed their design very closely). The Designer, Frank Stephenson, designed the car very much from the outside in. Once the shape was set, he refused compromise as all of the bits had to fit inside. While I have to admire his guts for sticking to his guns, the low bonnet line lead to huge limitations on the engine choice and the getting usable back seats and a worthwhile boot was impossible. The very same thing seems to have happened in the D4's transition from practical working vehicle to the D5's style icon.2011 - 2015: 3 x FL2
2015 - 2017: 2 x D4
2017 to date: FFRR SDV8
2023 to date: 2 x FL2 as “second” cars 🙄
2021 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200
2022 to date: Hinckley built ‘14 Triumph Trophy 1200 & sidecar!
(One of only two known to exist in the world!)
Last edited by Red Merle on 22nd Oct 2016 7:01 pm. Edited 1 time in total
22nd Oct 2016 6:20 pm
J77
Member Since: 03 Mar 2008
Location: Fife
Posts: 6270
Did you try the 2nd row seating in all positions?
why feel sorry for those of us you want to take one from launch? I either take one at launch and get cheaper road tax or wait until my intended replacement date of September and get shafted by the governments jealousy tax.23.5MY Defender 90 X-Dynamic SE D250 MHEV Pangea Green
22nd Oct 2016 6:48 pm
DSL Keeper of the wheelie bin
Member Since: 11 May 2006
Location: Off again! :-)
Posts: 73089
Doesn't new car tax regime come in from 1st April 2017? That's going to be pretty tight to beat that, assumes no delays.
Even with seats back (or I was told were back) "knees up"
If front seat occupied by leprechauns maybe but it's about seat height above the floor....
The tiered rows of seats are no more....even if they go up & down by button....another gimmick to go with the rest.BREXIT - done properly.
Right now ...We need Government - not Politics
Save the Dipstick Flagbearer-keep it simple, less likely to fail campaign-agenda items:Starting Handles, Acetylene Lamps.
Founder: Dipsticks-R-Us Inc
D3 HSE-perfectly formed, passenger friendly...has real DIPSTICK
Jag XK-but sadly no DIPSTICK...HUGE design fault
FL2 has DIPSTICK..."real comfort in rear seats"
VW Golf wondermobile (?)..has real DIPSTICK
Morris Minor..original DIPSTICK technology..and a real KEY.
22nd Oct 2016 6:55 pm
J77
Member Since: 03 Mar 2008
Location: Fife
Posts: 6270
DSL wrote:
Doesn't new car tax regime come in from 1st April 2017? That's going to be pretty tight to beat that, assumes no delays.
Estimated delivery date for me is 8/3/17.23.5MY Defender 90 X-Dynamic SE D250 MHEV Pangea Green
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
Allisport Fast Road Intercooler, V8 Brakes, Silicone IC Hoses, EGRs Blanked, Remapped, De-Cat pipe, FBHIC
)
me it should be
